Trump

[scyther]

Gorsuch seems like a pretty good choice. Hopefully he gets confirmed. Trump is coming through on his promises better than I expected, though I still worry about trade wars.

[Thogey]

I'm trying to wade through the CRAP and figure out what the rub is with the Flynn thing.

Here's what I gather. General Flynn, an NSA, screwed up. He "lied" "failed to advise" Pence on the content of a meeting with Russians.

The meeting, of which, is recorded in some way. There is a transcript?. So Pence winds up looking like a moron or a liar because he was relying on what Flynn told him.
Trump fires Flynn. I would fire Flynn. He is the NSA! If your are unable to advise then you are not fit for the task.

So. From what I understand, the mere fact that the content of this meeting with the Russians became public is a security compromise.
This is a big problem. The Russians might perceive big instability among Trump's people.

Of course it is impossible to have an opinion, because we don't know the facts. We weren't in the room.

[68Camaro]

I think that's more or less it. Flynn screwed up. Nothing illegal but he committed a major and inexcusable error in judgement and one that was doubly unnecessary. He deserves to be fired and it was the right thing to do at this point.

The larger issue in my mind is the illegal leaks coming from multiple senior positions in the
government, clearly from anti-Trumpers. This is treason; the leakers must be found and jailed and the leaks stopped.

[Thogey]

clearly from anti-Trumpers. This is treason; the leakers must be found and jailed and the leaks stopped.

Boy if that's the case Trump better hope the leaker isn't a minority or woman. Can you imagine what the news would do with that optic!

[blackrabbit]

I think it is just a cover story. I think it has more to do with this.

http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2017-02-14/hillary-trolls-michael-flynn-twitter-pizzagate-reference

and also from his past statements telling the truth about the USA creating ISIS.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y1oEoCRkLRI

The well organized high functioning psychopaths can't have a guy like that in such a position of power where some truth might slip out.

[blackrabbit]

Actually Fox news contributor Dennis Kucinich, (wow, never thought they would pick him up) makes probably the best argument for what is really going on. Flynn's cozy relations with the Russians get in the way of the new cold war and the hawks that want to keep poking the bear.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7j_ZfKmcnSk

[Treetop]

I wouldnt say I think blackrabbit or thogeys positions are wrong, but Im not sure either of those is what this is. I kinda wonder if they just had to cave to pressure and the Trump team is readying to build a case of some sort against whoever all these leakers are. Like trump or not it seems like a major security issue to me. While I dont fault whistle blowers that bring us info the public should know, having leakers run around playing politics against a sitting government of a super power seems horribly dangerous.

Ultimately it still looks like "globalism" versus "americanism" to me and the establishment section of both parties want trump to go down. Even if you dont like trumps script, I get the impression hes off the globalist script. For instance several republicans now pushing carbon taxes as the conservative answer to environmentalism. Most of these same people pretended to be against this up until now.

My guy tells me the way this plays out within a few months is a major purge of those moving against trumps people to much fanfare and gnawing of teeth. I find this talk of the logan act especially interesting. Most modern presidents arguably went against this, but we hear talk of it all of the sudden as if any of these sources cared before when it was a r or d globalist in there. Of course it seems he wasnt being honest, so could be just an easy person for trump to get out of the way early and he is still prepping for a greater sweep later.

I find it interesting so many anti establishment types see this as a win for them, when it appears it is the establishment who most wanted this guy gone having brought to the light several issues in the past with rumors he was about to do more.

Im not sure how much trumps hand is tied versus how much he is just watching and seeing who he can trust. If he is being blocked on things which he see,s to be then I dont think hes the type to sit by idly. Guess we will see.

[Big Dave]

How much of this is due to Obummers shadow govt?

[blackrabbit]

https://www.opednews.com/articles/The-Swamp-Strikes-Back-by-Pepe-Escobar-Backlash_Iran_Michael-Flynn_Neocons-170216-284.html

He is a very interesting take on the Flynn affair.

[Treetop]

Thanks for posting that blackrabbit. Its basically what I was thinking.

[68Camaro]

It was no doubt a set trap and Flynn was a sacrificed pawn. How many other traps have been set remain to be seen. As to the nature of the war you can already see trump wheeling to his strength, the middle class populist base that elected him. He's only 3 weeks in and already going back to public rallies to generate more support as well as huge funds. The press is playing to his strength. It's fascinating to watch. Was.never a big kt McFarland fan, not sure I like her at anything more than deputy.

[Thogey]

That swamp is a loud SOB when you try to drain it.

I don't know if the wall will go up. But there is some major heat on illegals these days.

They are just getting thrown the hell out..ohh and the sob stories.

Try this: sneak into any country on this planet, start a family off the books, see how it works out.

[Thogey]

What the hell is so great about Ivanka?

Do you guys like her?

[justoneguy]

Ivanka 2024 I'm with her->


Bumper sticker I just saw

[Treetop]

I read the other day that when ivanka brings an idea to her dad she makes the case she likes but is also expected to come up with three counter points that dispute her main premise. I find that pretty interesting.

Ive seen her say some interesting things but find it odd some speak of her political ambitions. She seems rather different then her father on several major issues an I couldnt imagine democrats embracing a Trump anytime soon.

[68Camaro]

What the hell is so great about Ivanka?

Do you guys like her?

Not going to fall on my sword in support of her because I'm not clear what she personally stands for. She clearly has extraordinary looks and while not a genius is smart and well spoken. She has unparalleled family ties on both sides (father and husband). And in relatively few years she's been able to connect with working middle class women and capture enough of their desires to create from scratch a 9 figure business. She has been a very effective communicator and representative for her dad. Not someone to be trifled with.

[scyther]

From what I've heard, she's responsible for a lot of Trump's bad ideas and opposes his good ideas (along with her husband- Trump's Jesse Benton). She's too liberal to be a Republican, and her association with Trump ("complicit!") will forever make her unacceptable to Democrats. I don't see a political future for her.

Then again, a few years ago I would've said Donald was too liberal to be a Republican president, so who knows.

[Thogey]

Time to review this thread and see where we are.

[johnbrickner]

My take is he is pretty much living up to my expectations except, he's done less damage than I anticipated when elected.

[Thogey]

"It depends upon what the meaning of the word 'is' is"

All kidding aside. It depends on what you consider disaster or improvement are. To me, the disaster would be our (the United States of America) continued: Status quo with more power and money being concentrated into the hands of fewer and fewer; disconnect with the destruction of the planet that sustains us; disconnect with the rest of the countries of the world as we pursue to maintain our status of Empire thru our politics and military; decrease in personal freedoms and community self-rule; corporate veil protection and corporate personhood; and the opaqued to completely recolored transparency of government behavior and international corporations just for starts.

Some would dare call it American Fascism along the lines of "When fascism comes to America, it will come wrapped in the flag and waving a cross" attributed to Sinclair Lewis.

An improvement would be a president who would start the process to engage and start the processes away from these directions. But, were a president to do so . . . well, the president would never be allowed to do so.

Is this where you think Trump is going?

[Treetop]

I often agree with John, but if he does think Trump fits most of that older post I definitely disagree. Trump is still not my ideal yet is imo the best president in generations. I expect he will be very popular before he is done despite where that stands right now.

[Thogey]

June 2016

Trump is just the conduit for all the people that are highly dissatisfied with the status quo. It is their way of saying "I am mad as hell and won't take it any more".
Look at what we have to chose from, more of the same or worse if any of them get elected. To many, Trump is a breath of fresh air to a suffocating public.
Would he be a good president? I don't know, but has any of our presidents been good to the working, tax paying middle class? I know I am worse off every year, and looking around I see many problems that never get fixed because money is always needed elsewhere.
I hope Trump does get elected, and with support from his followers, hopefully we can turn this country around, get our priorities in order, and make us proud to be Americans.

[Thogey]

Oh, and Trump would lose to Hillary anyway.

end rant

.

Wanna put $100 on it?

Nate was smart, he didn't take this action. Other's did. for some it was much more painful.

So What do you think so far?

[Treetop]

Best president in decades as far as Im concerned.

I had a longer reply written, but I dont feel like debating all the points I made if someone disagrees, lol.

[johnbrickner]

"It depends upon what the meaning of the word 'is' is"

All kidding aside. It depends on what you consider disaster or improvement are. To me, the disaster would be our (the United States of America) continued: Status quo with more power and money being concentrated into the hands of fewer and fewer; disconnect with the destruction of the planet that sustains us; disconnect with the rest of the countries of the world as we pursue to maintain our status of Empire thru our politics and military; decrease in personal freedoms and community self-rule; corporate veil protection and corporate personhood; and the opaqued to completely recolored transparency of government behavior and international corporations just for starts.

Some would dare call it American Fascism along the lines of "When fascism comes to America, it will come wrapped in the flag and waving a cross" attributed to Sinclair Lewis.

An improvement would be a president who would start the process to engage and start the processes away from these directions. But, were a president to do so . . . well, the president would never be allowed to do so.

Is this where you think Trump is going?

Let's see? More power and money being concentrated into the hand of fewer and fewer? Still happening so yes. Disconnect with the destruction of the planet? The EPA is being effectively neutered so, yes.

Disconnect with the rest of the countries? No, he is trying to protect what he can of the Empire not maintain the Empire. Perhaps a small difference between the two. But, he seems to have the foresight to realize we cannot maintain our status as we have in the past. Why I think he personally is on such good terms with Putin. We need an ally on China's back door and the Russians are really good antagonists. I still think he will continue to try to develop a relationship with Russia that he will benefit from. Possibly the U.S. will benefit from also. The only countries we seem to be disconnecting with are our (former?) allies. I am wrong as he is not maintaining the status quo of our Empire with our international politics and military but, somewhat right as there is disconnect.

Decreased personal freedom and community self-rule? Seems neutral to yes right now. I'm not seeing any decreased personal freedom on American Born unless they appear to be non-white. And communities that reject or stand up to certain federal edicts are facing potential difficulties. Especially those who harbor Illegal aliens. So yes to community self-rule.

Corportations? Yes. The huge Corporations continue to grow in power, money and influence. Especially U.S. corporations now that they are getting favored treatment over the internationals. At least here in America, our president will not cross the Elite, he is one of them.

Now the globalist elites are a different story so, International Corporations? No, I was wrong here but then I don't see any corporations getting decentralized or devolved. The American Corporations are getting favored treatment over the Internationals here in America.

Transparency of government behavior? Hummm, many things in our government are coming of light to be seen as never before. However, the whistle blowers are not being given hero status either, unless they are women with sexual allegations then they get to stand in line with the rest so maybe not heroes but, recognized. I'll give into this one, so no. But the dysfunction continues to run rampant.

Is fascism coming to America? If you are looking for jack boots and brown shirts, no. If you are looking a marriage between government and corporations, and the law shifting more their direction to increase their power and money, really? Are Americans aware, can this not be seen? This is American Fascism, not the fascism of old. True blue, home grown, American style. And don't be mistaken it will be enforced, legally.

Is Trump taking us there? You decide. You have a eyes, ears and a brain. I'm not debating what I see just answering the question put to me, but if given the opportunity I will attempt to jump into your shoes and see the world thru your eyes.