Realcent.org

Simple question but I'm looking for a complicated answer with a lot of info and numbers to back it up.

Do you mean "keeping" vs "sorting"?

Keeping is not complicated at all. If they come to you through everyday commerce you're only going to accumulate a small amount of copper yearly, so why not hoard them? $25 to $50 face isn't going to alter your lifestyle.

Sorting...whole different thing. For me, it was my age that decided it for me. I did it for 18 months and sold out. If I was 20-something I'd be hand sorting a ton every nine months again without breaking a sweat. As it is, I don't see big moves in base metals on my time horizon (maybe nickel). I'm also unconvinced that cents will ever be legal to melt, but that's a very distant secondary issue.

Bottom line for me: based on my income I wasn't going to be able to sustain a $3500 per year stash at the expense of other opportunities. And it made even less sense to sort less.

I would give you a detailed complicated answer but you would have to pay me in copper pennies as it would cut into my sorting time.

Sully, Here are a couple of my posts on the subject from past threads asking the question similar (this first one was regarding making money sorting pennies):

In the short term things do appear to be as you say. Especially as a small business enterprise in which one is selling one's time, effort, and intrinsic value for FRNs. It's going to take a big increase in the awareness of the masses to make this one happen on the small time level. And when that happens (that being the masses figure it out,) it will be to late. Better to be out of FRNs by that time and in your lifeboat.

However, with the intrinsic value of the penny at over 1 cent I will not be convinced having copper pennies as a stack of "sound money" is a bad place to put my efforts. The stack is effectively immune to the antics of both Pennsylvania Ave. and Wall St. short of physical confiscation. Thus far, stacking pennies (and other metal coins) is proving itself one of the most effective long term places to store the value of my life efforts save for my wife and children.

Additionally, shadowstats has the 1990 based: CPI at 5% and Consumer Inflation at 9% as of 10/30/13 but, I don't need shadowstats to see the people around me living lives of quiet desperation.

As long as the Fed keeps putting 9 zeros after the $85, and pressing enter on the keyboard each month, I'm going to keep stacking pennies. I won't fight the Fed's behavior towards assuring the decline of the Empire. Most of us will see the day China (with her allies help) passes America as the most wealthy nation in the world (one only need Google "China passes US economy" to get over 26 million results in about a quarter second,) if it hasn't happened already.

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Looks like you're asking is it worth it?

Like many, I've put a lot of time and money into a lot of things. Stocks, bonds, real estate, partnerships, hedge funds, mutual funds, PMs. A spectrum of "investments". Time, experience, and my family have had their affect on me so I take this whole stacking and sorting with a different time frame and frame of mind.

First, I'm looking long-term. How long? Perhaps several generations. So it really isn't being done to compare time and money to. Puts it into a kind of hobby form. I'm not using this as a way to get ahead in this world. If I were, I'd fell real shitty about the time I spend doing it. Not trying to "get ahead" anymore has given me a much better outlook on life. Perhaps not much of an improved outlook towards humanity as a whole but, much better personally.

Second, since I do look at it to compared against my past "investments" I can tell you I greatly enjoy taking $400 of my hard earned FRNs (Federal Reserve Notes,) passing them thru a Ryedale (was an Ace, now is Blue) and ending up with about $300 in FRNs and over $200 in sound money (see my recent post on sound money) value. The sound money part I stack and the FRNs get put back into the cycle.

Third, the sound money part isn't taxed and doesn't get devalued or debased or subject to mismanagement or manipulation, etc. and I can't say that about any of my past investments or FRNs. Fact is, I consider it a bit detached (when compared to typical investments available to the common man) from harm caused by Park Ave, Pennsylvania Ave, or Wall street. Being able to put my hard earned time, and life energy into something like that, well it doesn't get a whole lot better.
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I have a book (quite falling apart) called History of Coinage and Currency in the United States and the perennial Contest for Sound Money by A. Barton Hepburn, LL.D. <snip>

Sound money is described as:
"Sound money means money made of (or unquestionably redeemable in) a commodity which has a stable value in the markets of the world independent of fiat. Sound money as applied to coin means money wherein the commercial value of the bullion equals it coinage value. Sound money as applied to paper or token money of any kind means that which is redeemable in money wherein the commercial value of its bullion equals its coinage value.

The term "sound money" doubtless originated from the auricular test commonly applied to coins. the counter or other convenient surface offering an opportunity, the coin is dropped thereon, and its quality depends upon whether the resulting ring possesses the true sound or not.

The test of sound money varies with different periods, and is determined by varying conditions. It has, however, a general significance easily understood, is concise, cogent, and seems to have found a permanent place in our economic literature." pp 7-8.

Forgive the cut and paste but it was easier than rewriting from scratch.
Brick

Sullysullinburg wrote:Simple question but I'm looking for a complicated answer with a lot of info and numbers to back it up.

Nope, but I still do it.

In the long view the value will return. Investing we are taught to look to the long view.

There is the stress relief of sorting, and being able to reach long and short term goals.

The opportunity to learn from the great minds here.

That is a good question for Adam Youngs, see: http://portlandmint.com/. Apparently there are a large number of people who think sorting/buying and saving copper pennies are worth it. Ask any coin dealer who is selling copper wheat pennies if it is worth it.

What is the down side at the moment? The time value of money sitting idle. But then again what is the interest you are going to get at your local bank if decide to put that penny in the bank.

The US Mint is not making any more 95% copper pennies; why? Could it be the copper penny is worth more than a penny in metal value? Why would they put a ban on melting pennies if copper pennies were no big deal.

If you want a quick score, you should go one-on-one with a member of the Philadelphia 76'ers.