Chief wrote:As someone earlier in this thread said, maybe 40% halves are the way to go? Not worth the time to counterfeit.
natsb88 wrote:Thogey wrote:Where did you get this stuff?
Directly from China.
I intend to do side-by-side photos, dimensional comparisons, weights, show how to test with acid, etc. on my website. I'm not sure how me buying a very small amount to document and spread the word about could be considered "part of the problem" as you are implying. My little $30 order is not going to make or break China by any means, there is tons of this stuff (probably literally) out there. The only way to combat fakes is to know what to look for. The only way to know what to look for is to study it. I have fake Silvertowne bars, Pan American bars, Stagecoach bars, Sunshine bars, Prospector rounds, and ASEs for the same purpose. A comprehensive analysis will be posted on my website in the coming weeks.
beauanderos wrote:This whole episode raises another ugly question. Is there any sanctity in purchasing from online dealers? Even those with the best reputations? When they purchase large bulk lots from the public... do they have professional grade comparitors to scrutinize the coins, or are they merely running them thru coin counters like an LCS would??? Are we going to be forced to buy individual coins now, that one can instantly examine... preventing future sales of BIG lots that no one has sufficient time to evaluate individually? And yeah, not forcing China to shut down (as if that were possible) is merely part of a larger problem. You'll know how bad it is when you learn that JPMorgan has capitalized them (not beyond the scope of their duplicity, in my book). Of course... they do the same thing on a much grander scale... suckering people to buy worthless, non-metals back SLV and GLD ETF's
mflugher wrote:1. Semi foolproof tester is XRF analyzer gunonly $16k each, I figure if I get 1000 of you guys to buy one I can maybe afford one at $12k
2. Buying only from mint/over paranoia...
a. In the whole thread we have had 1 confirmed case of a fake being mixed into a lot. 1 measly half in what I presume to be tens of thousands of $ face 90% bought by this community.
b. The price of not hedging against inflation is far in excess of the cost of a few bad buys.
c. The cost of a few bad buys is far less than the extra premium of buying only from "orginal" mint sources
d. When its time to sell there is no way to prove you went to that extra expense to only purchase "original" mint sources and that extra premium goes out the window.
e. By publicizing what is currently a non problem we may create more of a problem in the future... How many people here have you seen say I will not buy a bullion bar over 10 oz of silver or 1 oz of gold because of the tungsten stories, again we are talking about a miniscule portion of the gold traded and about a dozen counterfeits ruined that market. How many criminals will see this being publicized and realize this is a good idea of their next scam? Are we potentially creating more of a problem than we are averting?
Just some food for thought.
Thogey wrote:Lemon Thrower wrote:Ray, pls explain what you mean by "frontload" your stash.
personally, i'm taking advantage of the high premiums on 90% to trade into more ounces of .999, so going forward it should be less of an issue for me. I don't think the Chinese are counterfeiting 1986 Santa Claus rounds yet.
Sorry LT
You are not safe
Guangdong is in the 1974 christmas silver business at a buck fifty each
http://www.alibaba.com/product-gs/64642 ... Z_999.html
68Camaro wrote:BTW re gold, many of the better major dealers are already xraying their non mint buys in gold.
scyther wrote:68Camaro wrote:BTW re gold, many of the better major dealers are already xraying their non mint buys in gold.
Glad to hear that. I wish they would do it for silver too. Is it too expensive or something?
mtldealer wrote:XRF scanner... Non destructive kind has issues with plated material. Our business has one and I test my metal. Yu gotta have a bunch of ways to test and have the metal pass all of them.
goodcents wrote:I buy a lot of NGC MS69 ASE's. If you buy them right there is a premium of course but I feel pretty secure in knowing they are real and when i buy in bulk they really are not that bad in terms of price. Are there people faking slabbed ASE's? I figured with Hologram and other things built in I'd be pretty safe. And the work involved to fake would be pretty rough.
It's very scary to think you are buying clad thinking all along you are getting real silver.
Thanks for posting this thread and to everyone chiming in with their tips/ideas
Joe
TwoPenniesEarned wrote:goodcents wrote:I buy a lot of NGC MS69 ASE's. If you buy them right there is a premium of course but I feel pretty secure in knowing they are real and when i buy in bulk they really are not that bad in terms of price. Are there people faking slabbed ASE's? I figured with Hologram and other things built in I'd be pretty safe. And the work involved to fake would be pretty rough.
It's very scary to think you are buying clad thinking all along you are getting real silver.
Thanks for posting this thread and to everyone chiming in with their tips/ideas
Joe
Nope. They are knocking off the holograms too. Check out this one:
http://www.aliexpress.com/item/Replica- ... 56551.html
Canadian 80% never looked so good.
beauanderos wrote:TwoPenniesEarned wrote:Canadian 80% never looked so good.
don't be so sure![]()
http://www.alibaba.com/product-gs/505108209/Canada_custom_challenge_silver_coin.html
Engineer wrote:I'm sure the big dealers can afford $17k for an XRF scanner, but they probably won't use them on bags of mercs or roosies until there's enough fraud to justify the labor and/or extra equipment.
beauanderos wrote:TwoPenniesEarned wrote:goodcents wrote:I buy a lot of NGC MS69 ASE's. If you buy them right there is a premium of course but I feel pretty secure in knowing they are real and when i buy in bulk they really are not that bad in terms of price. Are there people faking slabbed ASE's? I figured with Hologram and other things built in I'd be pretty safe. And the work involved to fake would be pretty rough.
It's very scary to think you are buying clad thinking all along you are getting real silver.
Thanks for posting this thread and to everyone chiming in with their tips/ideas
Joe
Nope. They are knocking off the holograms too. Check out this one:
http://www.aliexpress.com/item/Replica- ... 56551.html
Canadian 80% never looked so good.
don't be so sure![]()
http://www.alibaba.com/product-gs/505108209/Canada_custom_challenge_silver_coin.html
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