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Good>Evil

Neckro wrote:The Christians, Jews, and Muslims all worship the same God.

False. Absolutely false.

What does this have to do with the OP anyway???

Corsair wrote:A good point, RR, but Roman Catholics pray to the same God that Christians do. They also imprison and murder for the same God as Christians do.

Anyone can claim to do their actions for any reason or any thing. Just because someone does something "for God" doesn't mean it's right. 1 Samuel 15:22 says that "obedience is better than sacrifice". Just doing something for God because you think it's right doesn't make it right. It also doesn't make whoever is truly serving God wrong.

Corsair wrote:My only contribution to this thread, before the Galileo thing, was to say that Christians have killed many, many people in the name of their religion, and it would be hypocritical to cry wolf that they are now being killed without saying that, by the way, they did their fair share of damage in the past 1000 years.

Seriously this is such an erroneous viewpoint. Where are Christians killing anyone in the last 500 years? Where today? What American church has ever killed people? No one at my church has. So far as I know, the Presbyterian Church (my denomination) goes back to the late 1500s and has never been down for killing. If you can show me a widely respected American preacher or theologian in the last four centuries that called for killing non-Christians I'd be interested to know about it.

I am saddened by many of the comments here. I don't think many of you have actually read the stories in the links I listed.

Today, right now, there are millions of people who live in dire fear for their lives because they don't know when they will be singled out for persecution in their countries. They live in nations that are hostile to their faith.

Beginning in 1914, with the Armenian genocide, it is estimated 165,000 Christians die from persecution each year. It is also estimated that that number is rising.

These people are driven off their land with no place for a home. Raped. Tortured. Sold into slavery. Abducted and forced to convert to another religion. Forcibly married into a different religion never seeing their families again. Sent to prison on false blasphemy law charges. Murdered for refusing to renounce Christ.

And all many of you can do is argue over if and how Christians were violent during the Middle Ages??! Hell, it was the Middle Ages! Everyone was violent!! Some of you somehow justify the violence happening to these poor people today by what happened a thousand years ago??!

These atrocities are being committed right now! Where is the sorrow? Where is the sadness?

Unbelievable.

I started this thread because of what became an intense discussion of the meaning of being a Christian on another thread.

I thought if we all had a common theme, we could all find common ground to share.

When someone is persecuting you for your faith in Christ, it does not get more basic to a Christian than that. It does not matter if you are a Baptist, Catholic, Presbyterian, Coptic, Orthodox, Jehovah Witness, or some other denomination of Christianity... If the enemy has thrown you into a prison, or trying to kill you for your faith... the only thing that matters is Christ.

I learned this from Rev. Richard Wumbrand. He was a Romanian Jew who converted to Christianity. He was imprisoned for 14 years for refusing to cow-tow to the Romanian Communist Party. They did everything they could to break him, but it did not happen. He found true fellowship with thousands of other believers in the communist prison system. After being ransomed to freedom here in the US, he wrote a book entitled "Tortured for Christ" and founded a ministry called The Voice of the Martyrs. http://www.persecution.com/

Please stop arguing with one another. Please look at what the enemy is doing to your fellow believers right now. It is horrific and it is happening on our watch.

Compass Direct http://www.compassdirect.org/

Religeon does not kill people, fanatics and extremists that think they are righteous kill people. Self righteous is more like it, I do not condone any fighting in the name of any god. I'm a theist, but justification of war or harming any human being (all faiths included), is just wrong.

No one religeon can claim absolute truth, so it is nonsense to even fight about it. I believe a lot of science is nonsense too, however. Like for instance how can you profess a THEORY in science class, and reject other theory.

The only truths are that which we make for ourselves, from the evidence we are given. We might as well be friends with the people around us, because they aren't going anywhere.

If you can explain your existance, without harming another human being, or causing excessive torment towards others. By all means do it, I would love to hear (anyones is welcome).

The trouble is I can find holes in most religeons, and scientific theories.


That being said, from what I have found the Christian religeon is probably the most logical monotheistic religeon when practiced properly. It is a very practical and ethically sound doctrine.

Men above all other things should try to achieve peace. If we aren't looking for peace war will find us.

You can't blame an entire populus based on the decisions of a few. This goes for all religeons, or beliefs.

I claim responsibility for veering this thread slightly off course. Sorry about that. I do believe that the Muslim faith has more to back up their violence in the Koran. I believe we need to strongly speak out against the kind of oppression the Muslim faith practices today. I try to remain humble in my own views which are scientifically based. Never judge anyone who has an opinion on the meaning or cause of human existance because that ain't an easy thing to wrap your mind around.

scrapper2010 wrote:I claim responsibility for veering this thread slightly off course. Sorry about that. I do believe that the Muslim faith has more to back up their violence in the Koran. I believe we need to strongly speak out against the kind of oppression the Muslim faith practices today. I try to remain humble in my own views which are scientifically based. Never judge anyone who has an opinion on the meaning or cause of human existance because that ain't an easy thing to wrap your mind around.

Not all Muslims are extremists.

scrapper2010 wrote:I claim responsibility for veering this thread slightly off course. Sorry about that. I do believe that the Muslim faith has more to back up their violence in the Koran. I believe we need to strongly speak out against the kind of oppression the Muslim faith practices today. I try to remain humble in my own views which are scientifically based. Never judge anyone who has an opinion on the meaning or cause of human existance because that ain't an easy thing to wrap your mind around.

This demonizes over a billion people for something a few people have done. I'm not Muslim, nor do I support terrorist acts. Science has killed people, are all scientists bad people? No.

John_doe wrote: Not all Muslims are extremists.

Just the ones who are devout. The ones who are not what the politically correct call "extremists" are apostates and at risk of being murdered by the devout.

Study Islam. Remember, this is basically a two faced, double standard culture. As an example, they claim that the Koran forbids killing the "innocent", but, if you dig deeper, you will find that only Moslems can be considered innocent, and killing them is okay if incidental to killing someone who is "not a good Moslem", either unbelievers or even a Moslem who disagrees on some obscure point.

I do pray for the persecuted as well as the lost. We can not save all by our own actions.

Our current government is not supporting Christians here or anywhere I know of.

We need to work on cleaning Our own house before we try to convince others to fix other problems.

Pray for all and personally take responsibility for Correct actions showing your belief in a Christan God.

Peace to ALL

John_doe wrote:

scrapper2010 wrote:I claim responsibility for veering this thread slightly off course. Sorry about that. I do believe that the Muslim faith has more to back up their violence in the Koran. I believe we need to strongly speak out against the kind of oppression the Muslim faith practices today. I try to remain humble in my own views which are scientifically based. Never judge anyone who has an opinion on the meaning or cause of human existance because that ain't an easy thing to wrap your mind around.

This demonizes over a billion people for something a few people have done. I'm not Muslim, nor do I support terrorist acts. Science has killed people, are all scientists bad people? No.

If this demonizes the people you speak of, it is due to their inaction on correcting their fellow members of that belief system. What actions do they take when an extremist radical throws acid into the face of a young teenage Christian girl for refusing to have sex? What action do they take when an Iman participates in the abduction of a teenage girl, forced marriage, forced consummation of that marriage, and then delivery of a marriage certificate to the victim's family telling them they cannot see their child anymore???

Same can be said about your pope that helps support known pedophiles that have destroyed plenty of lives. Nothing like a church of god letting its disciples molest children, then helping them avoid justice. The actions of a few does not reflect that of many. If they were all horrible monsters that they're made out to be, they would've destroyed the world already. Pray to Christ he comes one day and completely destroys those filthy swine, so us Christians can be taken in the arms of Jesus and shown his love.

The most deadly religion in the history of the world, by far, is communism, followed by national socialism.

That quote about communism, is probably one of the truest things I have ever read on the internet.

Now...

I've got kin that married a muslim fellow. I've met him on several differant occasions, talked and he has always been a top notch, guy. Her family likes him, and he is real good to her. He bought a shop in town and remodled it for her so she can work at what she likes. As far as I'm concerned, he's kin now too.

I served in the Army with a few muslim guys. Great guys to be around. Not saying all are, but the ones I met and got to know.

Just as I consider what we call "Christianity" to have been hijacked and misinterpreted by those who lusted afterpower and control, could it not be safe to say that their core beliefs are also not highjacked in the interpretations by those after power and control? Or those who are riddled with hatred. Or the xenophobic?

There should be a lot less "inaction on correcting their fellow members of that belief system" as Shiek said, in ALL faiths and heaps more love and forgiveness. I've seen about as many BLOODTHIRSTY so called Christians as Muslims, or any other.

I agree with Rosco on our government not supporting Christianity at home, which is what we should focus on. We need to be vocal and lead by example in our daily lives.

Most importantly we need to "try the spirits" of those who would lead us, so we are not led astray.

Great post Kurr.

Neckro wrote:Same can be said about your pope that helps support known pedophiles that have destroyed plenty of lives. Nothing like a church of god letting its disciples molest children, then helping them avoid justice. The actions of a few does not reflect that of many. If they were all horrible monsters that they're made out to be, they would've destroyed the world already. Pray to Christ he comes one day and completely destroys those filthy swine, so us Christians can be taken in the arms of Jesus and shown his love.

Yes, Neckro. That is absolutely an abomination before the Lord and justice is being done to them who tried to cover it up. Delayed, but certain. Oh, BTW, he is not my pope.

There are few posts in sympathy for the plight of these poor people who are being abused and had nothing to do with all the evils the rest of you are talking about. The majority of you feel somehow this is Okay. Most make some comments that this is done by a small minority, or you know a few guys who were okay. OR, Christians have done evil in the past, so those poor bastards deserve what they get.

That is not the reality of the situation.

This is wholesale, and most of you don't give a damn.

I guess I am "in the wrong pew" and should not have started this thread.

Not at all. Anytime people can come together and speak freely we all have a chance to see contrast to our own opinions and bias' and learn.

Part of what was written is that we will be persecuted. We are given the strength to persevere those persecution, and lead by the examples we show in our lives. To love our enemies. To forgive, even unto death, as He said "Forgive them father, for they know not what they do".

Was not Saul one of the great killers and persecuters of Christians in his day? And yet he came to be the one called to be a great apostle in the teaching of the churches after his repentance.

Corsair wrote:A good point, RR, but Roman Catholics pray to the same God that Christians do. They also imprison and murder for the same God as Christians do.

Corsair.....Tisk-Tisk. Never fear though, I'll be praying for you.....

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=atBg9zLI2bA

Neckro wrote:The Christians, Jews, and Muslims all worship the same God.

Do Christians and Jews worship Allah? Do Jews and Muslims worship the Father, Son and Holy Spirit?