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Today Crimea held a referendum offering voters the choice of seceding from the Ukraine and seeking annexation by Russia or remaining in the Ukraine with more autonomy. Supposedly 95% voted to leave the Ukraine and join Russia.

What the US should do is stay the heck out of Crimea's business. But what we probably will do is slap all sorts of sanctions on Russia. Kerry has already said that the US and "the international community" will not recognize the Crimean vote for secession and that they are still a part of the Ukraine.

I'm pretty sure the US decided to declare independence from unfair rule one time, and didn't let third parties tell them what to do. Of course, we also had a part of the country wish to leave later, and the existing federal government waged a very bloody civil war to stop it.

So hard to get clear info here... but am I missing something or is it usual political nonsense? I fail to see why russia has less of a justification to be in crimea then we do to be in afghanistan, or iraq, or perhaps a much better example is libya. We come off as hypocrites on this imo.

well you see, were the US if we want to go out of our way to effect the politics of another nation including slaughtering its leaders, its no big deal. If russia moves in its totally different and really bad!!!

1 The illigitimate Ukraine government doesn't recognize doesn't recognize the legitimate Crimea government.
2 A referendum is held to define who is legitimate.
3 This is one hundred years since Archduke Ferdinand was killed to start the great war.

1+2+3=A very exciting year.

natsb88 wrote:Today Crimea held a referendum offering voters the choice of seceding from the Ukraine and seeking annexation by Russia or remaining in the Ukraine with more autonomy. Supposedly 95% voted to leave the Ukraine and join Russia.

What the US should do is stay the heck out of Crimea's business. But what we probably will do is slap all sorts of sanctions on Russia. Kerry has already said that the US and "the international community" will not recognize the Crimean vote for secession and that they are still a part of the Ukraine.

I'm pretty sure the US decided to declare independence from unfair rule one time, and didn't let third parties tell them what to do. Of course, we also had a part of the country wish to leave later, and the existing federal government waged a very bloody civil war to stop it.

I think you can make a solid historical and demographic case for the Crimea being reinstated (after 60 years) as a part of Russia. However, the tactics Putin is using to achieve this end are highly questionable. A referendum with a 95% result is difficult to take seriously; in fact it reminds me of the elections that Saddam Hussein used to hold when he was sill in power. This election was held barely two weeks after Russia sent troops in to occupy the region, with no U.N. or international observers allowed. Putin would have had more credibility had he left open even the smallest possibility of a "no" vote. Better still he could have allowed the Ukrainian May elections to go through. I think Putin knew he had to act before the Ukrainians were allowed to express their political will. Why? Because nothing could be left to chance.

coppernickel wrote:1 The illigitimate Ukraine government doesn't recognize doesn't recognize the legitimate Crimea government.
2 A referendum is held to define who is legitimate.
3 This is one hundred years since Archduke Ferdinand was killed to start the great war.

1+2+3=A very exciting year.

I agree that the legitimacy of the current gov't is in question. There are a lot of claims that the February revolution was engineered by the West. While this may be true, I've not seen any proof beyond supposition and innuendo. All that aside, wouldn't the May elections (assuming they are free and fair) create a legitimate government?

Obama calls Putin.....

TY Richard! Funny Stuff

I needed a good laugh this morning.

Regarding the lists of INDIVIDUALS who have sanctions against them:

The E.U. and U.S. lists have just four names in common: two top Crimean leaders who were instrumental in the drive for secession and two Russian legislators.
From: http://www.washingtonpost.com/world/nat ... story.html

If this is the best and most co-operative the west and the US (us) can do, Putin owns Eastern Ukraine. Aaaaaaaaaaand, it's gone. Were I a prominate Russian, I would wear my name being on the list like a badge.

johnbrickner wrote:Were I a prominate Russian, I would wear my name being on the list like a badge.

From what I've read, I think they are.

It’s possible Russia’s relationship with Iran may be part of the reason Washington hasn’t responded more aggressively to Putin’s belligerence in Ukraine. Is the Obama administration more concerned about peace with Iran than with America’s treaties with Ukraine or confronting Russia?

From: http://www.thetrumpet.com/article/11448 ... trump-card

Big O's plan has always been to crash the USA economy. Putin has provided an opportunity for that.

IdahoCopper wrote:Big O's plan has always been to crash the USA economy. Putin has provided an opportunity for that.

+1

Nine months down the road and the ruble is down some 40% and Ukraine drops her neutral status. The chess game continues . . . http://news.yahoo.com/ukraine-parliamen ... 48451.html