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With the recent flight to precious metals do you believe there will be a flight to base metal coinage (copper and/or nickel coins) next?

Ardent Listener wrote:With the recent flight to precious metals do you believe there will be a flight to base metal coinage (copper and/or nickel coins) next?

If there was a bigger and well advertised market for them, then there is no doubt that there would be an influx of participants

I'm hoping for a few more years before the "influx."

JPM Just started that copper ETF...

I agree that it´s a matter of not enough people being aware of any such thing. Yet. But that could change if the right person (people) brought up the subject in the right format with a sizable viewing/listening audience. Might be that we´re still just a little early for that to take place. But with 2.65 cents of copper in (copper) cent, and the price in a strong upward move, that can´t stay the same indefinitely.

With copper at $4/lb., more intelligent people may see the opportunity. I explained it (penny collecting) to my dad and he immediately saw the opportunity in it and asked why more people weren't doing it. He is an attorney/CPA with an economics degree, not an easily convinced person when it comes to investments. He asked where you can get large amounts and I explained you can do $50 bags at a time. Future Ryedale costumer?

Makes me feel good to be ahead of the curve for a change. Wish I would have been with silver....

4 people know I 'collect' cents. My Mom, who has forgiven me for many more grevious offences, my sister, her husband and daughter...the last 3 think I'm friggin NUTS. A real copper nut case. Tried explaining the situation to all and the hole I was digging myself into only got deeper. I swear they probably think I covet their plumbing and wiring. Well, now that you mention it... JK JK JK.

So NO I don't think base metal coin hoarding will 'be a thing' till the coin composition changes and even then most will turn their noses up at it.

Not even the family knows about my stacks of nickels. That's my secret.

AGgressive Metal wrote:With copper at $4/lb., more intelligent people may see the opportunity. I explained it (penny collecting) to my dad and he immediately saw the opportunity in it and asked why more people weren't doing it. He is an attorney/CPA with an economics degree, not an easily convinced person when it comes to investments. He asked where you can get large amounts and I explained you can do $50 bags at a time. Future Ryedale costumer?

attorney/CPA? Maybe for that kind of job, he should go portland mint with storage so he doesnt have to lug the zincs back to the bank

I think we are all slightly ahead of the curve here. There are more and more people starting to wake up and if you ask me they need to stay asleep or else we'll have to start making use of hoardy's approach pretty soon "just sort more". That's fine and dandy but when more and more start pulling coins banks won't be so generous. I've already seen three local lobby counters limit or start charging for the services because of over dumping and such in the last year. The more sheeple that stay asleep the better at this point unless you have already reached your hoarding goals. Mine, there is no limit but I'm not smacking down 1k face a month either to go stacking, just saying it still nice to swing by the bank and pick up a few boxes and sort around 20%. On a side note, no one in my family thinks I'm nuts Thank God, I've been hoarding pennies since I was 5, being the youngest sibiling I always recieved the pennies, who wants them stinking silver things.... 100 pennies looks a lot better than 4 quarters in my piggy bank That and constantly crawling under every vending machine because I saw two pennies and a nickle under there, lol.

It gets a little trickier at the higher levels. You just have to spread you action around a lot more. Too many new players entering the field will not be a good thing. There is a reason the banks stopped ordering shiny new quarters after the 50th state.

Ardent Listener wrote:With the recent flight to precious metals do you believe there will be a flight to base metal coinage (copper and/or nickel coins) next?

Ardent, yeah i do.

dont know the timing, all i know is this: bout a year and a half ago, i got hipped to website, by a fellow posts as "ferfal" called "Survival in Argentina", and as you know, those boys had a real nasty financial meltdown. What he was relaying is that besides empty ATM's and currency controls, was that coinage just dissapeared into hoards, meaning folks trusted coins more than paper, even the debased stuff.

Now i dont have the patience to sort thru bank boxes, (its that dang ADD) plus i wanna use the banks to grab $100 boxes of nickels, using my "need 'em for youth group bingo night" line...the teller's go, "isnt that sweet", so i dont want to burn them out.

with pennies, i buy $100 FV bags of pre-82's on ebay.......i just paid $180, and i know that's "cheating" in the minds of penny hoarders, but i have to ramp up and quick. These idiots seem to trying to hold the whole mess together with chewing gum and bailing wire, and QE2's, its not going to work. Plus from what i'm reading, we might be 15 years from peak copper....who knows.

Now i know Ryedale is the rage, but that money i'd rather buy a hand cranked wheat miller, same price. Keep an eye on the price of wheat, its no joke, and things we always assumed as Americans, ie "food security". might be just that, an assumption. for about a decade the margin in global wheat stocks has been razor thin, and its getting worse. i'm not talking "Mad Max", but more like Joseph in Genesis, when he counsled the pharaoh. (google "WASDE"---world ag supply demand estimate)

i think the whole thing, as we move forward into the 21st century, is the question, what is REAL currency, and i for one, do not trust any institution i grew up trusting, because they have proven not worthy of my trust.

now, i got a lot of rolling to do.....

neil

yes and no.

the prices of pms and copper are set by the big users and investors, not folks like us.

copper ultimately has little investment demand the price moves due to industrial demand. china is buying copper because they'll use it over the next several years, but in the west there is an economic slowdown reducing demand.

ultimately, they'll stop making even the zinc penny because its too expensive and a waste of time. at that point the banks will stop carrying any pennies and if you don't have your hoard built its too late.

Ardent Listener wrote:With the recent flight to precious metals do you believe there will be a flight to base metal coinage (copper and/or nickel coins) next?

For me, it's a no brainer. Copper will one day be like we treated silver in 1963-64. Most people just kept spending the silver until it disappeared ('cause smart people hoarded it). RealCenters' are way ahead of the curve, but I am seeing the stuff disappearing now. Used to easily get 33% copper in a brick. Now, it's more like 12 - 15% copper.

Buy gold. When you can't buy gold- buy silver. When you can't buy silver- buy nickel and copper. Easy as pie.

I dont know exactly how it will work but when the price goes up , and more players enter the sorting arena; banks will see an uptrend in dumps and pickups. Lets say a 5 dollar pickup per box charge and no coin counter charge for dumps. 25 dollar box at 20% Cu 5 Dollars of Cu for that box plus 5$ box ordering cost. Already without any markup, you are into this "new scenario" copper for 2x face (without added expenses fuel time, WD40 for Hoards Penny Cart ) When before you were into the same Cu for 1x face (without added expenses fuel time... for Hoards new shocks in the Camry.....)

It's the struts that cost.. not the shocks. At some point the deal might pencil. There will never be a better time for hoarding than right now.

TXBullion wrote:

AGgressive Metal wrote:With copper at $4/lb., more intelligent people may see the opportunity. I explained it (penny collecting) to my dad and he immediately saw the opportunity in it and asked why more people weren't doing it. He is an attorney/CPA with an economics degree, not an easily convinced person when it comes to investments. He asked where you can get large amounts and I explained you can do $50 bags at a time. Future Ryedale costumer?

attorney/CPA? Maybe for that kind of job, he should go portland mint with storage so he doesnt have to lug the zincs back to the bank

Don't worry, I'm sure zinc lugging would be my job, haha.

neilgin1 wrote:

Ardent Listener wrote:With the recent flight to precious metals do you believe there will be a flight to base metal coinage (copper and/or nickel coins) next?

Ardent, yeah i do.

dont know the timing, all i know is this: bout a year and a half ago, i got hipped to website, by a fellow posts as "ferfal" called "Survival in Argentina", and as you know, those boys had a real nasty financial meltdown. What he was relaying is that besides empty ATM's and currency controls, was that coinage just dissapeared into hoards, meaning folks trusted coins more than paper, even the debased stuff.

Now i dont have the patience to sort thru bank boxes, (its that dang ADD) plus i wanna use the banks to grab $100 boxes of nickels, using my "need 'em for youth group bingo night" line...the teller's go, "isnt that sweet", so i dont want to burn them out.

with pennies, i buy $100 FV bags of pre-82's on ebay.......i just paid $180, and i know that's "cheating" in the minds of penny hoarders, but i have to ramp up and quick. These idiots seem to trying to hold the whole mess together with chewing gum and bailing wire, and QE2's, its not going to work. Plus from what i'm reading, we might be 15 years from peak copper....who knows.

Now i know Ryedale is the rage, but that money i'd rather buy a hand cranked wheat miller, same price. Keep an eye on the price of wheat, its no joke, and things we always assumed as Americans, ie "food security". might be just that, an assumption. for about a decade the margin in global wheat stocks has been razor thin, and its getting worse. i'm not talking "Mad Max", but more like Joseph in Genesis, when he counsled the pharaoh. (google "WASDE"---world ag supply demand estimate)

i think the whole thing, as we move forward into the 21st century, is the question, what is REAL currency, and i for one, do not trust any institution i grew up trusting, because they have proven not worthy of my trust.

now, i got a lot of rolling to do.....

neil

I have seeds for a range of things for a SASE....

i think you are spot on. Our food system is also much to cumbersome, and not very adaptive, being controlled at a few central points. there are many exceptions, but not enough to go around. So MANY factors could limit food, leading to severe rationing. I I also think being able to produce some or all of your own food, could be the best investment anyone can make. The more people who do so, the better off our country will be. the more PM holders who do so, the faster you will be able to get back on your feet, and presumably carry others, after the dust settles. You dont want to trade your retained wealth in the form of metals, for basic needs like food.

Collect leaves from curbs, or manure from ranchers... or get a local landscaper to dump a bunch of organic matter. (depending on the outfit, some have to pay to discard such things) start collecting perennial plants with edible parts. depends on where you live as to what that would be. Plant some fruit and nut trees, things that dont need sprayed. EVERY place has a few. Get a few winter and spring planted grains, and grow a small patch each year, it can be a tiny spot, just to see which varieties do best, but more importantly to save up some seed. You can do it at any level, but its not hard to at least supplement your diet, without much work. Obviously growing ALL your own food is a lot of work. Dont over extend yourself and then give up. But i do strongly advise getting fruits, nuts and berries going, and collecting organic matter, and trialing a few grains and legumes(other crops to but those are the most important) to see what works best, and build up a stock of locally adapted seed.