Pennies vs. Nickels a hypothetical

[MetalMonkey1980]

So I have been doing some research into buying a ryedal coin sorter and am truly debating whether or not I want to buy one. And so I looked further into the melt values of pennies/one cent coins and nickels/five cent coins.

From what I have read Ryedale coin sorter have processed upward of 1 million coins.

With that understand I took 1 million pennies or $10,000fv and compared it to $10,000 fv nickels and this is what I came up with tell me if I am missing something.

Pennies: Based on 25% return$10,000fv processed
$7400 zincs returned
$2500 copper Melted (It is currently illegal to melt these coins...for hypothetical purposes only)
$100 wheats Kept

$2500 fv of copper pennies = 1700 pounds

95% copper
5% zinc

1615 pounds of copper
85 pounds of zinc

Spot Prices as 1/21/13
Copper= $3.68 lb
Zinc= .91lb

1615x$3.68=$5,943.20
85x.91=$77.35
Total melt value= $6,020.55
- $2500 inventory
$3520.35

this assumes zero waste.

If we were to work in a reasonable 10%+/- factor then profit could be $3,168=/-
Factor in $500 for a Ryedale
Factor in $100 replacement parts/1 million coins processed
factor in state of the art burner for melting (cost unknown)
Factor in Fuel (cost unknown)
factor in delivery costs (I have spoken to Loomis and can get $10,000fv worth of coins delived to my home for $32. If I want them to pick up my return coins it would be a total of $64. Which they would deposit back into my account for me...no fuss no hassle.
Factor in castings for molds and such.

I estimate $2500+/- profit per $10,000fv processed
But would you need to refine the copper and zinc before selling to a junk yard?


Nickels: I keep everything 1969 and before (just a prefrence...no special reason)based on 5% return$10,000 processed
No rydale needed
$9500 melted
$500 kept

$9500fv in nickels weighs 2094.75pounds

75%copper 25% nickel

1571.06 pounds copper
523.68 pounds nickel

as of 1/21/13 spot prices:

Copper= $3.68lb
Nickel= $7.88lb

1571.06x$3.68=5781.50
523.68x$7.88=$4126.59
Total Melt value= 10,008.09
-$9500 inventory
$508.09profit per $10,000fv processed

Build in a 10% waste factor
Factor in Deliver costs listed above
Factor in castings and such
Factor in a state of the art furnance
Factor in Fuel costs

Projected profit for first $10,000fv nickels processed
$250+/-

Potential profit from pennies with 10% waste and costs= $2500
Potential profit from nickels with 10% waste and costs= $250

No Brainer=pennies

Any thoughts

Metal Monkey


(It is illegal to melt these coins this is only hypothetical)

[ScottyTX]

I have always held the opinion that hoarding 25% nickel and 75% copper metal discs that are very easily obtained is a waste of time and waste of resources in oppertunity costs/investments... Personally I would rather hoard toliet seats as my mother-in-law has managed to break 5 of them in the past year...... Pennies are by far the greater choice but thats just my opinion!?!

[Zincanator]

At gov't pricing, toilet seats could actually be a windfall if you can sell them to politicians .

[JadeDragon]

I have yet to see anyone here get coins delivered by armored car. If anyone could get $10,000 face for $35 than a number of people here would be all over it.
So tell us more about how you can get the coins delivered and picked up.

[Engineer]

I have yet to see anyone here get coins delivered by armored car. If anyone could get $10,000 face for $35 than a number of people here would be all over it.
So tell us more about how you can get the coins delivered and picked up.

1. Rent a building
2. Name it something similar to XXX mint
3. Call the armored car companies, and try to convince them your name is Adam.

[scyther]

If it were legal to melt nickels, I wouldn't bother searching for pre-70. I'd just throw them in a pot. I wonder if you could economically recover the silver from the few war nickels,though...

[ZenOps]

So very hard to calculate. Nickel is 8.21/pound today. What if it spikes back up to $23 or beyond?

I've always felt that copper has limited upside. Its in no countries best interest to see the price of copper get too high as its in far too much critical infrastructure. While one could argue that JPMorgan got into the paper silver game to manipulate the price up, I argue that they are getting into the copper game to manipulate the price of copper down.

Nickel is nickel, its the devils metal just like silver.

[reddirtcoins]

I for one would exclude these:
*Factor in state of the art burner for melting (cost unknown)
*Factor in Fuel (cost unknown)

Once the melt ban is off it would be much easier to just haul bags to the recycle. I'll just go to uhaul and rent a trailer for a few days. I also am pulling all my wheats and any AU/BU and sticking those away for my children's, children's, children's... Just think if someone would have done that with AU/BU bags of IH's back in the day.

[scyther]

Well, the cost of fuel and equipment will be factored into however much the people you take it to will pay you for it.

[Numis Pam]

I have yet to see anyone here get coins delivered by armored car. If anyone could get $10,000 face for $35 than a number of people here would be all over it.
So tell us more about how you can get the coins delivered and picked up.

+1 another inquiring mind wants to know the info on this statement!!

[johnbrickner]

At gov't pricing, toilet seats could actually be a windfall if you can sell them to politicians .

Who can forget the military procurement horror tales of the early 1980s –
immortalized by the $435 claw hammer, the $640 toilet seat and $7,600
coffee makers ?

Thanks for bringing back the memories, Z.

[Silver Runner]

Good information to know.

[penny pretty]

nice post for a new member! I have been trying to hoard beer as well, but it just keeps disappearing

[fonestar]

My theory is that both copper cents and nickels could absolutely soar in value. Just look at the trillions of dollars in the bond market globally, the trillions of dollars in the derivatives market, the real estate market, the MBS market, equities, etc, etc, etc. Now imagine a crisis of confidence and divide those markets by the precious little **real** assets on Earth per capita. It's not hard to see how anything real, fungible and of some value could wind up having great value in the future as the number of people increases and the ROI in energy decreases.