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Shanghai traded down the limit. its a wreck.

European exchanges opened anywhere from 1.5% to almost 3% down on the german DAX, down about 330 points, and its still dark in the US, its about 0350 (Cst)....the dollar opened up fairly strong, while the euro got cratered, this was about 4 hours, now they're flipping, the Euro is still down from 1100 pips lower to now 550 lower, while the dollar was 70 higher, now its 25 higher. no big deal, these parasites are probably having a gut churning day, good, they deserve worse.....and will get it.

y'know how I been focusing on Deutsche Bank?....its that small matter of the $75 trillion in derivatives they hold. I went to look at it, in depth....charts mean little these days, coz they know how to paint the tape, but I look at the 10 year, just for context....pre 08? $150-170 a sheer....now 32-30. whatever. the two things I zero in, are insider transactions, which are SEC mandated....guess what....you got a big "N/A" there. thats confidence inspiring, then I go look at short sell interest...because if the stock has been heavily short sold, its easy to squeeze and kill shorts. Now this POS zombie bank has a float of 1.27 billion shares, with a short interest of....wait for it....10 million shares...that's less than 1% of the float. moderate short interest is HEALTHY for any stock in a down market, because short covering acts as de facto SUPPORT, but looking at the whippy action in this dog, the ECB and their lap dogs have probably burned more shorts than can be counted, so........10 million shares short of a 1.27 float


PM's are a lil higher, I think the "guys" got bigger things to worry about....like global contagion.

this is going to be a very bizarre trading day......

coming to a mall near you?

Neil, Your experienced insight is much appreciated. Thank you.

I don't understand why PM prices are not skyrocketing at this point in the game? What more instability needs to happen? The collapse of Greece, China's stock market tumble, and even little Puerto Rico with the governor saying that the island’s debts are not payable, surprise! Well neither are the total debts of the US government, but I digress.

Who else has to tumble? Italy, Portugal, Ireland, Spain? No one ever talks about the biggest elephant in the room i.e. the total exposure that global banks have to derivatives contracts i.e. 710 trillion dollars! When is that bubble going to burst? Folks we have a global Ponzi scheme going on and nothing appears to be capable of stopping it. When will the madness end?

TY Neil. Idaho Cu says it all for me.

can't even find much data on the Chinese stock market... news media slyly averting their eyes?

neilgin1 wrote:Shanghai traded down the limit. its a wreck.

European exchanges opened anywhere from 1.5% to almost 3% down on the german DAX, down about 330 points, and its still dark in the US, its about 0350 (Cst)....the dollar opened up fairly strong, while the euro got cratered, this was about 4 hours, now they're flipping, the Euro is still down from 1100 pips lower to now 550 lower, while the dollar was 70 higher, now its 25 higher. no big deal, these parasites are probably having a gut churning day, good, they deserve worse.....and will get it.

y'know how I been focusing on Deutsche Bank?....its that small matter of the $75 trillion in derivatives they hold. I went to look at it, in depth....charts mean little these days, coz they know how to paint the tape, but I look at the 10 year, just for context....pre 08? $150-170 a sheer....now 32-30. whatever. the two things I zero in, are insider transactions, which are SEC mandated....guess what....you got a big "N/A" there. thats confidence inspiring, then I go look at short sell interest...because if the stock has been heavily short sold, its easy to squeeze and kill shorts. Now this POS zombie bank has a float of 1.27 billion shares, with a short interest of....wait for it....10 million shares...that's less than 1% of the float. moderate short interest is HEALTHY for any stock in a down market, because short covering acts as de facto SUPPORT, but looking at the whippy action in this dog, the ECB and their lap dogs have probably burned more shorts than can be counted, so........10 million shares short of a 1.27 float


PM's are a lil higher, I think the "guys" got bigger things to worry about....like global contagion.

this is going to be a very bizarre trading day......

coming to a mall near you?

Neil, I've said this before and I will say it again. Your posts on this and other subjects (besides baseball ) are very helpful and insightful for me as I try to learn more and more on the global implications or ramifications this has on all currencies. I do have a "naive" question for you but what are "pips"? I'm trying to increase my knowledge on terms and acronyms but I thought I would ask you.

Thanks again for your post my friend

Copper Catcher wrote:I don't understand why PM prices are not skyrocketing at this point in the game? What more instability needs to happen? The collapse of Greece, China's stock market tumble, and even little Puerto Rico with the governor saying that the island’s debts are not payable, surprise! Well neither are the total debts of the US government, but I digress.

Who else has to tumble? Italy, Portugal, Ireland, Spain? No one ever talks about the biggest elephant in the room i.e. the total exposure that global banks have to derivatives contracts i.e. 710 trillion dollars! When is that bubble going to burst? Folks we have a global Ponzi scheme going on and nothing appears to be capable of stopping it. When will the madness end?

yeh, I hear ya......the better question might be "when will the madness BEGIN'?.....but your right, $710 TRILLION of toxic debt sludge crap?....is MAD...its insane, its spooky, scary and just downright depressing....so depressing I cant even remember what I was gonna write, except to thank Idaho, JohnB, and Stack for their thanks yous....I thank YOU guys, because we all talk(write) to each other like we're face to face, and that is RARE on cyber media....this is the only forum I ever go to, and that's because the fellowship is so nice, and i'm a lonely guy. God bless the guys who created realcent, and the admins, (Catcher) who maintain it...its like our lil cyber campfire, we can sit around, and shoot the sh#t, we all have the same interests and worldviews....and i'm THANKFUL, and any bit of stuff I can contribute?, I'm THANKFUL.....(that said, believe me, I was NOT proud of MY role in the whole "JFF" thing, lemme just say that)so, God bless you all,n.

Did someone say....

beauanderos wrote:Did someone say....

my FIRST thought OB, was what round would I have to use to put that thing down?...serious, and I got some good stuff......then it came to me...the realization of what your implication is ....and i'm sad to say, I cant resist, to put this clip up...heck after today I need a laugh and you might too, so enjoy

June 30: Just read a smattering of main stream financial news articles this AM and its funny they all seem to think Greece defaulting (they admit it already has) is not going to effect the US. The deception continues....

So Greece fails to pay today saw that coming a mile away. IMO they go back to the Drachma and loses all credit and GDP falls to 12%. What incentive do they have to pay. Responsible negotiation and paying your debts ??? Of course that's the proper course of action.

Business 101 - you can't spend more than you make (also a home budget 101 rule)

And now I here Puerto Rico is coming really close as their debt it also astronomical. I don't have the exact Billions of dollars but it's way to much. I would like to hear your thoughts on how Puerto Rico's debt crisis could effect the U.S...if any. I don't know much about this subject except that they use the U.S. $. I know our relationship with PR but don't completely understand if their financial situation lowers our credit rating because they use the $ ?

Any feedback would be appreciated.

Thanks

SS

neilgin1 wrote:

Copper Catcher wrote:I don't understand why PM prices are not skyrocketing at this point in the game? What more instability needs to happen? The collapse of Greece, China's stock market tumble, and even little Puerto Rico with the governor saying that the island’s debts are not payable, surprise! Well neither are the total debts of the US government, but I digress.

Who else has to tumble? Italy, Portugal, Ireland, Spain? No one ever talks about the biggest elephant in the room i.e. the total exposure that global banks have to derivatives contracts i.e. 710 trillion dollars! When is that bubble going to burst? Folks we have a global Ponzi scheme going on and nothing appears to be capable of stopping it. When will the madness end?

yeh, I hear ya......the better question might be "when will the madness BEGIN'?.....but your right, $710 TRILLION of toxic debt sludge crap?....is MAD...its insane, its spooky, scary and just downright depressing....so depressing I cant even remember what I was gonna write, except to thank Idaho, JohnB, and Stack for their thanks yous....I thank YOU guys, because we all talk(write) to each other like we're face to face, and that is RARE on cyber media....this is the only forum I ever go to, and that's because the fellowship is so nice, and i'm a lonely guy. God bless the guys who created realcent, and the admins, (Catcher) who maintain it...its like our lil cyber campfire, we can sit around, and shoot the sh#t, we all have the same interests and worldviews....and i'm THANKFUL, and any bit of stuff I can contribute?, I'm THANKFUL.....(that said, believe me, I was NOT proud of MY role in the whole "JFF" thing, lemme just say that)so, God bless you all,n.

Neil, this is undoubtedly the most "positive" site I've ever found in my life as well. I know some lonely people, even family members that choose to stay lonely. Much love here brother. Stay strong my brother. That " campfire" reference hit the nail on the head. With all the Bull sh#t faceboo$s and other outlets on the web, it's nice to actually find a place like you said with a fellowship of people with common interests and respect for each other . God Bless Neil

Brian

I don't consider myself very wise in this company so I don't weigh in much on these topics. But I do greatly enjoy reading them and hearing your perspective. Than you Neil for posting and your contribution to this community. If you ever see a nice stand of sugar maples go up for sale in your area, let me know, haha. I think you would be a great neighbor!

silverstacker wrote:
Neil, this is undoubtedly the most "positive" site I've ever found in my life as well. I know some lonely people, even family members that choose to stay lonely. Much love here brother. Stay strong my brother. That " campfire" reference hit the nail on the head. With all the Bull sh#t faceboo$s and other outlets on the web, it's nice to actually find a place like you said with a fellowship of people with common interests and respect for each other . God Bless Neil

Brian

Brian "Stack", man that is a nice post to read, much love too, serious. There a quite a few posters I have the same feeling for sight unseen in this little cyber haunt. I also believe the reason a great degree of respect and bon home exists is because guys here are ALSO doing for real grown up business, buying and selling PM's and BM's, and kitchen sink stuff....and its not too confidence inspiring if somebody acts out of line, then wants to bid or offer. the reason I don't buy here, is because I have a TOUGH time doing business with FRIENDS.....for me, and this is just me, my head, when I trade (in this case, just buying Ag, I CANT sell a toz of silver) I get real COLD inside, very impersonal, I don't WANT to "know" the seller, and that's why I USED to like Ebay so much, to buy rolls of 40's and 90's and ASE's...all I had to KNOW is the seller a square dealer. I would spend HOURS, going over their feedback...or the description of the roll offered, and if the tiniest lil thing didn't ring right, I would just pass it by. I dealt with maybe 6 to 10 regulars, and also a bunch of idiot grandson's dumping their dead granddad's stack of silver...and thank God, I never ONCE got jammed in about 400 buys.

(one time when I bought a roll of GEM/Bu 73S Proof Ikes, a good seller, had a clad Proof Ike in the roll, that's when I learned the lesson that in 73 and 74, the mint made both clad and 40%'ers, and its the weight that does the tell....clads are 22.6 gms, and 40's are 24.6 gms...the seller made me good asap. i'm a nut, every single coin recvd, was weighed and glassed, and then put back in the tube, which went in various lockboxes into the safes, where they remain....never had to give out negative, and didn't receive ANY negative, coz I would pay within two minutes TOPS, of the auctions end, sellers love that, coz your reputation is all you got in the business of trading....and I mean trading ANYTHING, your word is your BOND, its sacred, as far I as see it. That's why I loathe guys like Jamie Dimon, or the leadership at the CME so intensely. Mercantilism, which is REAL capitalism is the only way, that all humankind can live full and productive lives, and when you denigrate that system of trade, and LIFE?....you just open the gates of hell to communists, crooks, socialists, oliogarchs, all the foul rotten depraved men among us, and if it was up to ME?....brother, I would bring back the STOCK, that's the ole skool form of punishment for crimes....where both arms and legs are put thru, and its set up in the public square, exposed to both the elements AND public humiliation. i'd bring back the TAR AND FEATHER! no joke...cold tar though, coz I wouldn't want the public purse to pay for the hospital to tend to burns and infections for these curs...sorry for the rant, but these haircuts that call themselves "men" have set this country on the road to RUIN!...and in a decent society, would held ACOOUNTABLE for their high crimes and misdemeanors, up to the highest rank, their battalions of lawyers and money would be for naught...in a decent society! sorry for the rant, i'm just livid...there's no honor anymore, just "gimme, gimme, gimme!")

but in late 12/early 13, the roll section is silver US coins, got spooky, the shelves got bare, word of Chinese counterfeiting was loud, and then Nate showed that pictures of all those counterfeits of US 90%'er's and that was it. I have a nice, authentic stack of 40 and 90 rolls, found the new 14/15 Maple Leaf, PayPalCredit had this deal......0% interest, 12 months to pay, did a monthly calculation, and bought what I could do painlessly every month.....thank you Nate!.....my stack isn't "for sale", its a "break glass in event of emergency" type thing.

oh shoot, your question...a "pip" is a word for what we in the ag sector called a "tick", which is a unit of measure in futures or cash trading...I've never traded an FX future in my life, only ag's, the meats and grains....also crude oil....never currencies, haven't trusted them from day one, in 1981. You see, a bushel of wheat....cant LIE, a hog cant LIE.

God love you, n.

neilgin1 wrote:

silverstacker wrote:
Neil, this is undoubtedly the most "positive" site I've ever found in my life as well. I know some lonely people, even family members that choose to stay lonely. Much love here brother. Stay strong my brother. That " campfire" reference hit the nail on the head. With all the Bull sh#t faceboo$s and other outlets on the web, it's nice to actually find a place like you said with a fellowship of people with common interests and respect for each other . God Bless Neil

Brian

Brian "Stack", man that is a nice post to read, much love too, serious. There a quite a few posters I have the same feeling for sight unseen in this little cyber haunt. I also believe the reason a great degree of respect and bon home exists is because guys here are ALSO doing for real grown up business, buying and selling PM's and BM's, and kitchen sink stuff....and its not too confidence inspiring if somebody acts out of line, then wants to bid or offer. the reason I don't buy here, is because I have a TOUGH time doing business with FRIENDS.....for me, and this is just me, my head, when I trade (in this case, just buying Ag, I CANT sell a toz of silver) I get real COLD inside, very impersonal, I don't WANT to "know" the seller, and that's why I USED to like Ebay so much, to buy rolls of 40's and 90's and ASE's...all I had to KNOW is the seller a square dealer. I would spend HOURS, going over their feedback...or the description of the roll offered, and if the tiniest lil thing didn't ring right, I would just pass it by. I dealt with maybe 6 to 10 regulars, and also a bunch of idiot grandson's dumping their dead granddad's stack of silver...and thank God, I never ONCE got jammed in about 400 buys.

(one time when I bought a roll of GEM/Bu 73S Proof Ikes, a good seller, had a clad Proof Ike in the roll, that's when I learned the lesson that in 73 and 74, the mint made both clad and 40%'ers, and its the weight that does the tell....clads are 22.6 gms, and 40's are 24.6 gms...the seller made me good asap. i'm a nut, every single coin recvd, was weighed and glassed, and then put back in the tube, which went in various lockboxes into the safes, where they remain....never had to give out negative, and didn't receive ANY negative, coz I would pay within two minutes TOPS, of the auctions end, sellers love that, coz your reputation is all you got in the business of trading....and I mean trading ANYTHING, your word is your BOND, its sacred, as far I as see it. That's why I loathe guys like Jamie Dimon, or the leadership at the CME so intensely. Mercantilism, which is REAL capitalism is the only way, that all humankind can live full and productive lives, and when you denigrate that system of trade, and LIFE?....you just open the gates of hell to communists, crooks, socialists, oliogarchs, all the foul rotten depraved men among us, and if it was up to ME?....brother, I would bring back the STOCK, that's the ole skool form of punishment for crimes....where both arms and legs are put thru, and its set up in the public square, exposed to both the elements AND public humiliation. i'd bring back the TAR AND FEATHER! no joke...cold tar though, coz I wouldn't want the public purse to pay for the hospital to tend to burns and infections for these curs...sorry for the rant, but these haircuts that call themselves "men" have set this country on the road to RUIN!...and in a decent society, would held ACOOUNTABLE for their high crimes and misdemeanors, up to the highest rank, their battalions of lawyers and money would be for naught...in a decent society! sorry for the rant, i'm just livid...there's no honor anymore, just "gimme, gimme, gimme!")

but in late 12/early 13, the roll section is silver US coins, got spooky, the shelves got bare, word of Chinese counterfeiting was loud, and then Nate showed that pictures of all those counterfeits of US 90%'er's and that was it. I have a nice, authentic stack of 40 and 90 rolls, found the new 14/15 Maple Leaf, PayPalCredit had this deal......0% interest, 12 months to pay, did a monthly calculation, and bought what I could do painlessly every month.....thank you Nate!.....my stack isn't "for sale", its a "break glass in event of emergency" type thing.

oh shoot, your question...a "pip" is a word for what we in the ag sector called a "tick", which is a unit of measure in futures or cash trading...I've never traded an FX future in my life, only ag's, the meats and grains....also crude oil....never currencies, haven't trusted them from day one, in 1981. You see, a bushel of wheat....cant LIE, a hog cant LIE.

God love you, n.

Thanks Neil, I really appreciate the insight and your comment "...there's no honor anymore, just "gimme, gimme, gimme!".

This 40 year old sees that progressively day after day and its a real shame. Thanks for the definition as it only makes my knowledge that much grander. (Now I also have to weigh all my Ikes too )

God Bless,

Brian


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NHsorter wrote:I don't consider myself very wise in this company so I don't weigh in much on these topics. But I do greatly enjoy reading them and hearing your perspective. Than you Neil for posting and your contribution to this community. If you ever see a nice stand of sugar maples go up for sale in your area, let me know, haha. I think you would be a great neighbor!

NH,
funny you should mention a stand of Sugar's....i'll tell you in a second why, but thank you for the kind words. I love your State btw, I have a very close friend lives there. and he gave me an old "Live Free or Die" NH t-shirt, which I gave to my boy...who attends Berkeley in Cali, and my son is a low key, but hard core Jeffersonian Dem, which means Libertarian, which means he cant wear it in that denhole of confused and privileged young socialist one world types. Not cause he's a wimp, he just knows what hill to die on, you get me?...the lad was brought to a dojo, when he was 4, plus his shot is pure and clean. He was firing a .300 UltraMag with a heavy barrel when he was 11, and just nailing them at 200 yards, so he knows how to TCB.

anyway.....the "stand of sugars".....i'm on a ridge, and it dips into a steep hollow to the north, and comes up into another ridge, attached by the same gravel/dirt track.......and this ridge in 2011, the last 27 acres was an old "sugar camp", meaning that for the 600 yard ridgeline is lined with HUGE and smaller sugar maples....and at the end bluff, in a clearing is a stout cabin, and shed and outhouse...PERFECT for sugaring, and in 2011, when I first got here, she was offering it for 99k. I wanted it, but inexplicably she took it off the market...why, I dunno.

Now there's a minor problem, at the head of her straight ridgeline dirt track, there sits this beautiful, well cared for, buff cabin , put a well in, septic line, and I think he's a prepper, and that's his bug out cabin, which is cool, and from time to time, never winter, you see his truck for a day or two...no problem right? BUT, he might be a "lone wolf" prepper, which IMO isn't that wise. i'll explain in a bit.

Now, I said "i'm a lonely man", right?....but I aint alone. right across from me, down the ridge a bit, is a family, and the husband and I have become tight friends....as well as his wife, and kids, and his young 20 something son, who is pals with my son, and they are part of a huge clan in these parts, and I've been "adopted"....and the husband and I, he's a nail and hammer guy.....we talk, and I steered him towards thinking "prep"...so (thank God) i'm not a "lone wolf", but this guy in the cabin, before the old sugar camp IS....and I found out, where "he's at" in his head space. I have a another pair of neighbors, older retirees, late 60's/early 70's, good folks, the husband had a real GOOD tech job, nice pension, they're classy people, the house is beautiful, nice stuff, art, books....and though they are Obama dem's, I could care less....they even took me out to dinner for my birthday...so anyway, in 2011, they had me over for dinner,and we're chatting, and I asked them, "whats the story with the guy over in that cabin?"

oooooooo boy, did their faces darken...I said, "what?...what happened?"

the husband said, "the dinner was going okay, but then HE started talking politics"....(remember, this couple are Obama dems)...and it got bad, because we weren't yelling, but he stood up, put both fists flat on the table and started hollering at me...and then he huffed off and left....and after he left I told S. (his wife) I DONT EVER want to see that man in this house again!"

and if know this man, he's SO low key and friendly, my neighbor.......I didn't even ask what was said, but I could imagine, and this man, probably did a slightly right of Genghis Khan rant AT them...and for what purpose?...the purpose is....now I got intel on this guy, it means if TSHTF, and if he does get lucky enough to get out, and get up here.....I got a problem, because I now I got a guy, who is undoubtedly gunned up.....and I already know he has no control, anger issues....and I don't KNOW him.

It might all be a moot point, coz a lot of these guys that maintain well stocked bug out locales AND live in the metro areas...its a roll of the dice...how so?....well, God forbid, if there is a game changing big bad ugly event, that has folks wanting to flee urban areas, unless one discerns the signs BEFORE the event, and bolts....forget it. remember a few years back, when the mayor of Houston gave the evac order before a hurricane, and you had that 100 mile traffic jam?....case in point. people running out of gasoline, or maybe didn't water, food...must have been a nightmare.....here:

https://en.wikinews.org/wiki/Massive_tr ... ar_Houston

http://www.slate.com/articles/news_and_ ... ingle.html


and thank you , hopefully I would be a "great" neighbor, because I would be swift to introduce myself, and my big front porch has seen many a bull session over root beer and rye, spinning tales of wars won, women conquered and all sorts of savage lies and various boll shot....lol, affectionately, n.

oh yeh Brian.....weigh them Ike's!!....serious.....you'll notice with the 40%'ers a variance from 24.0 to 25.0 gms, but I love that coin, and I loved the man, a great leader

Thanks for the story Neil. Wish I could find 27ac here for 99K that was loaded with maples!

You never know, that guy in the cabin could still be a good friend of yours some day. Tread lightly and all, but I know some guys that are great guys, but have been known to blow their tops when someone starts being supportive of our dear leader. Not saying what he did was right (it's not). Just maybe not a solid dis qualifier on a person. There are some good reasons to be upset about the guy! (and many many others)

neilgin1 wrote:oh yeh Brian.....weigh them Ike's!!....serious.....you'll notice with the 40%'ers a variance from 24.0 to 25.0 gms, but I love that coin, and I loved the man, a great leader

One of my favorites a man deserving of 5 stars

neilgin1 wrote:Shanghai traded down the limit...

this is going to be a very bizarre trading day......

coming to a mall near you?

The sign is written in English. Could it have been photoshopped?

Recyclersteve wrote:

neilgin1 wrote:Shanghai traded down the limit...

this is going to be a very bizarre trading day......

coming to a mall near you?

The sign is written in English. Could it have been photoshopped?

these days?....anything is possible, any lie passable. personally? i'm near overload...I WANT to turn off the laptop, not read the "news", not scan the various financial instruments....do you ever feel that way? like its all getting to be too much?

NHsorter wrote:Thanks for the story Neil. Wish I could find 27ac here for 99K that was loaded with maples!

You never know, that guy in the cabin could still be a good friend of yours some day. Tread lightly and all, but I know some guys that are great guys, but have been known to blow their tops when someone starts being supportive of our dear leader.

sound advice.....oh yes, I always tread lightly, in all matters.....the "guy in the cabin"? I always relish making new friends, but as the days grow....more strange and divisive, i'm cautious, true friendships, as I believe it, are born in the ring of fire, shared adversity, which is when you can see what lays within the persons coda, their soul. and when I hear of people "blowing their tops", or any sort of drama, my "coyote" melts back into the forest. I've seen those of the so-called "left" ....blow their tops, after they've bloviated about "peace and love", just as this man of the so-called right, blew his top, after breaking bread with what is basically a harmless pair of older retirees, after they got transparent with their worldview.

i'm not perfect (lol) I was once an angry young man, and the foundation of that anger was based on fear, fear is the opposite of Faith, as I see it, and I remember the second "Royal Commandment" Jesus spoke, "love your neighbor as yourself", if that simple Commandment embedded itself in every heart, I guess, this earth would resemble Heaven.....but then Heaven wouldn't be Heaven.

27 acres of an old sugar camp for 99K, that was a 2011 quote. prices both in the towns, and rural land have bounced up about (guessing) 10-20%...mostly houses in the small towns though, populations of said towns ranging from 200 people to the county seat with 4,000. Just land, or forested land, have remained flat....most houses are older and smaller, in the 1200 sq ft realm, you used to see offers ranging from 69 to 129k....but I've also noticed a lot more for sale signs up, and alternately these properties moving at slightly higher prices.

if I remember my figures right from the NASS of the USDA, I believe both NH and Vermont lead the........oh wow, Vermont's king of maple syrup, we did 3.17 million gallons last season(2014).....NH did 112,000 gallons, with a tenth the taps of Vermont....NASS is a neat site for ag statistics
syrup: www.nass.usda.gov/Statistics_by_State/N ... 605mpl.pdf

or the whole site http://www.nass.usda.gov/

n.

silverstacker wrote:And now I here Puerto Rico is coming really close as their debt it also astronomical. I don't have the exact Billions of dollars but it's way to much. I would like to hear your thoughts on how Puerto Rico's debt crisis could effect the U.S...if any. I don't know much about this subject except that they use the U.S. $. I know our relationship with PR but don't completely understand if their financial situation lowers our credit rating because they use the $ ?

SS

So, I have been reading up on this whole territory thing and it seems kinda murky. And by that, I mean that they are US Citizens, you clear customs down there and are considered the US, but they are not a state, and have their own taxes, but use our dollar exclusively.... It is all kind of confusing. I do know that Puerto Rico has issued Municipal Bonds in the past to raise capital, similar to states.

So, if my memory serves me correctly, in the actual states, if one would buy a municipal bond from their own state, it is triple tax free (no fed, state. local tax), but if you buy a bond from another state, you must pay the state/local taxes on it. You do not have to pay the Fed taxes. Now, with PR.....they are triple tax free for every single state. This makes it attractive for investors to invest in PR from all 50 states. Fund managers know this, so I am sure that many of us with 401Ks or portfolios managed by someone else are invested in PR through these bonds as part of a well rounded portfolio without even knowing it. So, how will it impact the US citizen.....well, one way is that many of the people with these investments will take it on the chin to a certain degree. That is one way the average everyday working man gets hurt by it. Your 401K just became a 301K.

I am sure it is not that simple, but you get the point.... The US citizen will more than pay for their $76Billion debt one way or another. It may not be a direct bailout, but it will be by hidden costs, losses on investments, and government programs promised them as citizens. This is all because some group of politicians saw cheap money, and did not plan on a worst case scenario to pay it back. Why would that matter? They will deal with it later, and frankly, after they have spent the money, what is anyone going to do? You need lemons to make lemonade. They have no lemons and they have chopped down the lemon tree. And, since there will likely be no penalty for chopping down the tree, the US taxpayer will be charged with planting new trees....and we all know how long it takes for a tree to bear fruit.

Gobirds66 wrote:

silverstacker wrote:And now I here Puerto Rico is coming really close as their debt it also astronomical. I don't have the exact Billions of dollars but it's way to much. I would like to hear your thoughts on how Puerto Rico's debt crisis could effect the U.S...if any. I don't know much about this subject except that they use the U.S. $. I know our relationship with PR but don't completely understand if their financial situation lowers our credit rating because they use the $ ?

SS

So, I have been reading up on this whole territory thing and it seems kinda murky. And by that, I mean that they are US Citizens, you clear customs down there and are considered the US, but they are not a state, and have their own taxes, but use our dollar exclusively.... It is all kind of confusing. I do know that Puerto Rico has issued Municipal Bonds in the past to raise capital, similar to states.

So, if my memory serves me correctly, in the actual states, if one would buy a municipal bond from their own state, it is triple tax free (no fed, state. local tax), but if you buy a bond from another state, you must pay the state/local taxes on it. You do not have to pay the Fed taxes. Now, with PR.....they are triple tax free for every single state. This makes it attractive for investors to invest in PR from all 50 states. Fund managers know this, so I am sure that many of us with 401Ks or portfolios managed by someone else are invested in PR through these bonds as part of a well rounded portfolio without even knowing it. So, how will it impact the US citizen.....well, one way is that many of the people with these investments will take it on the chin to a certain degree. That is one way the average everyday working man gets hurt by it. Your 401K just became a 301K.

I am sure it is not that simple, but you get the point.... The US citizen will more than pay for their $76Billion debt one way or another. It may not be a direct bailout, but it will be by hidden costs, losses on investments, and government programs promised them as citizens. This is all because some group of politicians saw cheap money, and did not plan on a worst case scenario to pay it back. Why would that matter? They will deal with it later, and frankly, after they have spent the money, what is anyone going to do? You need lemons to make lemonade. They have no lemons and they have chopped down the lemon tree. And, since there will likely be no penalty for chopping down the tree, the US taxpayer will be charged with planting new trees....and we all know how long it takes for a tree to bear fruit.

oh S###! you gotta be kidding me!!....well, I just learned something new today!!! lol.....no lol, but lol.....great research....you know what the kind of sick thing is, about this all?.....I read "76bln USD", and think, 'oh, only 76 bil......that's not THAT much'.

I heard today the Greek debt...(pop 11 million?) is 350 something billion.....Silver has GOT to be worth a lot more than $16 a toz on the "board".....maybe not, we did watch all those souls pass up Mark Dice in that video, offering a 10 toz bar for peanuts.

but than again, those were Americans....an Indian from India would KNOW what that bar was worth.