CFTC investigation

[rexmerdinus]

http://www.kitco.com/reports/KitcoNews2 ... pdate.html

Thoughts?

[Copper Catcher]

Since it is either the government itself or someone of their choosing doing all the manipulation I don't see any real change occurring!

Last Friday silver exploded through $35 at the COMEX open. Logic would lead you to believe that silver would hold at $35 and possibly run higher in future weeks

But guess what happened…the cartel understood the predicament and responded with a massive paper dump on the market to stuff price back below $35.

Between 10:35 and 10:50am EST, an astonishing 62.5 million ounces of paper silver were indiscriminately dumped on the market to induce the sell-off- nearly twice US annual silver production of 36 million ounces!!

Anyone with half a brain could plainly see that this is nothing but pure manipulation!

What I find amazing is all this only made silver drop sixty-cent. Also, it can't help but make you wonder what the real ratio is of paper to real physical silver?

Another note: The 09-21-2012 the silver COT report shows the bank cartel increases their silver net short position by 16 million ounces! Crazy, isn’t it?

So the question remains does the cartel have what it takes to kill the silver market more? My guess is, absolutely!

Interestingly...James Turk predicts $400 Silver & $8,000 Gold Between 2013 -- 2015

http://www.silverdoctors.com/james-turk ... 2013-2015/

[shinnosuke]

Good info, CC.

China, Russia, others are buying physical PMs. My contrarian (cranky) old self thinks they're on to something.

[rexmerdinus]

Yeah, CC, I kinda got some of the same out of it. To me it reads like Chilton knows there's nefarious deeds afoot, but he can't (or won't openly) prove it. So the question is, does JPM win and get away with it? Does the manipulation continue ad infinitum? Something that always bothered me--If the massive paper-dumps are mere stopgap measures and are becoming less and less effective with each successive one, why do they keep doing them? What I mean is, if they're just postponing the inevitable and they know they can't keep doing it forever, what keeps them doing it? It's like they're holding a bridge together until the last horse is across and then they can let it collapse--so what's the "last horse" in this scenario? Are they gradually lessening their exposure with each successive paper dump so at some point they can simply let go and let the whole thing fall apart, and yet still survive?

I'm admittedly uninformed in the paper market area, but it just seems like there's something more at work here, something that they're waiting for or something. Otherwise why keep trying to run out the clock?

And yeah, I realize this is kinda rambly--my sleep meter is a quart low right now!

[beauanderos]

Yeah, CC, I kinda got some of the same out of it. To me it reads like Chilton knows there's nefarious deeds afoot, but he can't (or won't openly) prove it. So the question is, does JPM win and get away with it? Does the manipulation continue ad infinitum? Something that always bothered me--If the massive paper-dumps are mere stopgap measures and are becoming less and less effective with each successive one, why do they keep doing them? What I mean is, if they're just postponing the inevitable and they know they can't keep doing it forever, what keeps them doing it? It's like they're holding a bridge together until the last horse is across and then they can let it collapse--so what's the "last horse" in this scenario? Are they gradually lessening their exposure with each successive paper dump so at some point they can simply let go and let the whole thing fall apart, and yet still survive?

I'm admittedly uninformed in the paper market area, but it just seems like there's something more at work here, something that they're waiting for or something. Otherwise why keep trying to run out the clock?

And yeah, I realize this is kinda rambly--my sleep meter is a quart low right now!

Pure speculation on my part here... since I don't follow every move any longer, nor read prodigiously about silver like I used to. But guys like Jeff Nielsen (Bullion Bulls) and others theorize that JPMorgan is playing both sides (to compare to your analogy of why keep the bridge together... the last horse is the banks swiping every ounce of physical silver they can from once "strong hands" as the previous holders get disgusted with all the manipulation and give up). Theoretically, presupposing that JPMorgan is acting as an agent provacateur for the govt, then they have unlimited power (wealth of meaningless fiat) to move the markets through the gyrations we continue to see. Even if they don't represent the govt... they are "too big to fail" and can count on endless bailouts. So that explains their wallet. Now then... why do they continue? Every time the price drops, not only are they filling their shorts... they are also acquiring as much physical as they can. Who says they can't do both? Make paper profits and also scoop up their self-induced sale-priced silver when markets plummet? No one knows for sure when physical scarcity will induce the end of paper manipulations... but when it happens, the banks will already be sitting on a hoard of physical metals. When their paper games are up, their physical will become the workhorse carrying their profit loads. That's when they'll let the bridge collapse and encourage everyman to jump on board. Because then the price will skyrocket... but physical silver won't be anywhere to be had except at multiples of its current prices. I have read that Silver Wheaton is running into competition from JPMorgan bidding against them to acquire silver streams from metals yet unmined from fledgling mining companies in need of capital.

[Lemon Thrower]

Since it is either the government itself or someone of their choosing doing all the manipulation I don't see any real change occurring!

it really boils down to this. and you can bet that whoever is doing it - jpm, exchange stabilation fund, etc. - is exempt from prosecution due to national security. so the investigation is all just a sideshow.

[rexmerdinus]

Pure speculation on my part here... since I don't follow every move any longer, nor read prodigiously about silver like I used to. But guys like Jeff Nielsen (Bullion Bulls) and others theorize that JPMorgan is playing both sides (to compare to your analogy of why keep the bridge together... the last horse is the banks swiping every ounce of physical silver they can from once "strong hands" as the previous holders get disgusted with all the manipulation and give up). Theoretically, presupposing that JPMorgan is acting as an agent provacateur for the govt, then they have unlimited power (wealth of meaningless fiat) to move the markets through the gyrations we continue to see. Even if they don't represent the govt... they are "too big to fail" and can count on endless bailouts. So that explains their wallet. Now then... why do they continue? Every time the price drops, not only are they filling their shorts... they are also acquiring as much physical as they can. Who says they can't do both? Make paper profits and also scoop up their self-induced sale-priced silver when markets plummet? No one knows for sure when physical scarcity will induce the end of paper manipulations... but when it happens, the banks will already be sitting on a hoard of physical metals. When their paper games are up, their physical will become the workhorse carrying their profit loads. That's when they'll let the bridge collapse and encourage everyman to jump on board. Because then the price will skyrocket... but physical silver won't be anywhere to be had except at multiples of its current prices. I have read that Silver Wheaton is running into competition from JPMorgan bidding against them to acquire silver streams from metals yet unmined from fledgling mining companies in need of capital.

That makes a lot of sense. I don't know why I didn't consider the "playing both sides" part. Thanks for the insight!