question..post dollar, copper to silver ratio?

[neilgin1]

maybe i can write good...not a bad shot, i'm a loyal friend...i can make good firewood, i can add, subtract and divide...but i know enough to know, what i dont know, so here's the question, post dollar ratio's.

i've always thought that the 64 Kennedy half, 90% would be a benchmark....that coin would be worth something.

the real nickel would be worth something.

the pre-82 penny would be worth something.

can anybody figure how a formula, ie....how many pennys to the nickel....how many pennys to the 90% half?

then to take that further, what would be the copper/silver ratio.......999 pures on both sides?

i cant wrap my head around that....i know that sounds stupid, and i feel stupid, but i was looking at Nate's copper bars, thinking about my buckets of 95% coppers, my bricks of nickels, and my stack's of 90's and wonder how they would all ratio out.

anybody got any idea's, a formula? thank you!

[beauanderos]

penny and nickel will retain their old ratio under a new devalued dollar... one to five. I imagine they would increase tenfold in the event of a dollar devaluation, coupled with an increase in their recognized value due to their intrinsic worth. But silver will no longer be money utilized in mercantile exchange, as it will prove too cumbersome to negotiate with when its price soars. The possible exception might be one gram of .999 silver, say for instance if you're buying a week's worth of groceries. I'm assuming $500 to $600 silver under this scenario, but with the endless QE's silver will more likely surpass gold's current valuations within this decade. I could foresee the innovation of "silver paper money" in which a few mil thick strip of silver was embossed upon a paper bill. The strip could be narrowed and shortened, as needed, to float with its then current valuation, if their were yet financial instability at that point following a reversion to a partially bimetallic backed dollar, or NWF (New World Fiat)

[Z00]

Well, at the speed at which we are going downhill.... someone needs to start developing a 99.9% copper gram. And a press to stamp them out.
Would hate to break my back lugging in all the groceries that I would need to buy with my silver roosies?

[beauanderos]

penny and nickel will retain their old ratio under a new devalued dollar... one to five. I imagine they would increase tenfold in the event of a dollar devaluation, coupled with an increase in their recognized value due to their intrinsic worth. But silver will no longer be money utilized in mercantile exchange, as it will prove too cumbersome to negotiate with when its price soars. The possible exception might be one gram of .999 silver, say for instance if you're buying a week's worth of groceries. I'm assuming $500 to $600 silver under this scenario, but with the endless QE's silver will more likely surpass gold's current valuations within this decade. I could foresee the innovation of "silver paper money" in which a few mil thick strip of silver was embossed upon a paper bill. The strip could be narrowed and shortened, as needed, to float with its then current valuation, if their were yet financial instability at that point following a reversion to a partially bimetallic backed dollar, or NWF (New World Fiat)

brain fart.... one gram will only be worth $19.29 at $600 silver... but you get the idea, right? At some point in time, those little gram bars and rounds are actually going to come in handy

[AGgressive Metal]

Copper and nickel are industrial metals which means their demand/price is largely tied to economic activity. I'd say the precious metals would gain more value than the base metals in a dollar collapse, especially since there would be a major influx of scrap metal as people scrapped everything they can get their hands on like is happening in Greece right now.

[neilgin1]

penny and nickel will retain their old ratio under a new devalued dollar... one to five. I imagine they would increase tenfold in the event of a dollar devaluation, coupled with an increase in their recognized value due to their intrinsic worth. But silver will no longer be money utilized in mercantile exchange, as it will prove too cumbersome to negotiate with when its price soars. The possible exception might be one gram of .999 silver, say for instance if you're buying a week's worth of groceries. I'm assuming $500 to $600 silver under this scenario, but with the endless QE's silver will more likely surpass gold's current valuations within this decade. I could foresee the innovation of "silver paper money" in which a few mil thick strip of silver was embossed upon a paper bill. The strip could be narrowed and shortened, as needed, to float with its then current valuation, if their were yet financial instability at that point following a reversion to a partially bimetallic backed dollar, or NWF (New World Fiat)

Ray,
i knew you'd get back on this one, good job that...its late in the evening...(for me, so can we REALLY get into this tommorrow in depth?....coz this is the whole reason why we stack...Boy Scouts? Be Perpared?).......but what you're saying right here, shifts the paradigm a whole lotta bit.....i aint disagreeing with you one iota, i'm of the conviction too, (nominal) price of $500 plus,

so ...lets just take a 40% Kenn, with .15 toz of silver....or a 90 dime with .07 toz of silver...here's what i dont understand you wrote:

" But silver will no longer be money utilized in mercantile exchange, as it will prove too cumbersome to negotiate with when its price soars."

do you mean that 40 Kenn....oh wait, i get it....since silver would be "worth" 600 2013 dollars, that .15 toz of silver in a 40 Kenn, would be akin to having a hundred dollar bill and a fifty dollar bill in me mitts?.....or the knightly American Silver Eagle ...just one .999 silver coin would have the buying power of anywhere from 600 to thousand (2013) dollars?

(i been sitting here for ten minutes just looking at these typed words, thinking of the implications and trying to collate all that)

man!...the implications of when "post dollar" happens are enormous, no wonder the dots are buying lead in the billion of rounds, it aint a "jack boot" thing in totality, its that most people, the "nine meals away" 'average person' crowds...and the hordes that chimp out on Black Fridays, (you see them on youtube) ....when 'post dollar' comes...(when NOT IF)......people are going to die, a lot of them.

(another ten minutes go by).......THATS what you meant by going "fractional"!! there's what, 31...or 32 grams in a toz, right?..

i wanna pick this up in the morning..too many weird strange calls coming in, n

[neilgin1]

Copper and nickel are industrial metals which means their demand/price is largely tied to economic activity. I'd say the precious metals would gain more value than the base metals in a dollar collapse, especially since there would be a major influx of scrap metal as people scrapped everything they can get their hands on like is happening in Greece right now.

yeh,,,,true, good point...i been reading everything i can get my hands on about daily life in Greece, grim tales....and they arent a quarter arrogant or spoiled like a lot our fellow citizens....i want razor wire.

[ZenOps]

Copper is more a growth metal. Nickel is a more a war metal.

The only time nickel ever got to extreme valuations against the dollar and/or other metals was during WWII and the Korean war. In fact, if you compared the price of nickel in 1942 against gold (nevermind silver) I think people would be shocked. Noone in the US ever does, because we Canadians will always supply you with as much nickel as you need

1969/1970 was also a high point for nickel, although I have struggled to figure out why, I did come across this:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sudbury,_Ontario_tornado There was an F3 tornado that shut down the mines that year.

[AGgressive Metal]

Interesting observations ZenOps. I wonder what the primary military use for nickel is.

[dannan14]

Interesting observations ZenOps. I wonder what the primary military use for nickel is.

Armor and high stress parts like jet turbine blades i think

[Engineer]

Kevlar and other synthetic armors have done quite a bit to cut back on the military use of nickel.

[ZenOps]

Kevlar and other synthetic armors have done quite a bit to cut back on the military use of nickel.

Yup, better WWII helmets used to contain 5% nickel, and better tanks, and fighter jets planes to this day still need nickel. Reactive armor as also cut down on nickel in tanks (although many use both)

Nickel helmets are rare nowadays, they are often not used as Kevlar is much lighter. Its not necessarily better mind you, as the best would technically have both (kevlar over nickel helmet with an airgap or foam insert) In a time of war, having an extra ounce of nickel in your helmet was probably more important than having a gold ounce in your pocket.

Oh, and it is interesting: With new technologies like XRF, people are scanning the old WWII bullets and tanks and helmets. No surprise, the base infantry just got bare minimum while the officers etc got better made armor and weaponry (higher nickel content armor, and better quality bullets and firearms) even though they looked exactly the same on the outside.

Silicon carbide seems to be all the rage nowadays http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dragon_Skin

But its still never a bad idea to have a nickel plate under your seatcover in a vehicle (Always knew there was a use for a box of nickels, lol)