Worst case scenarios if the penny is abolished?

[JerrySpringer]

If production of the Lincoln cent ceases, what are the possible outcomes which would put a damper on our copper cent collecting? I can think of a few. The government forbids melting the Lincoln cents until further notice or just outright does not address lifting the melt ban. Also possible, the actual intrinsic metal value of the pre 1982 cents is not even offered in the market place -ie- whoesale buyers literally offer at best pennies on the dollar of the metal value of the coins. To add further insult, the sale of the copper cents to a melter generates a hefty tax liability for the seller, thereby making the hoarding and sale of copper cents not worth the lost time value of the physical coin being tied up in bags,buckets, jars, etc.


Inevitably, the tens of thousands or millions of tic tac and FacialBook influencers will gush about this make a buck quick thing going on. Banks will stop handing out pennies and all the zincolns will be a pain in the butt to get rid of.

[Recyclersteve]

Lots of people would be taking huge quantities of pennies to their local Coinstar machines.

Lots of people would likely have copper pennies for sale on eBay, but the prices would likely be ridiculous when you factor in freight and eBay seller charges.

It might be interesting if you could find a decent YouTube video showing how Canada handled this since they stopped producing cents in 2012.

[JerrySpringer]

Lots of people would be taking huge quantities of pennies to their local Coinstar machines.

Lots of people would likely have copper pennies for sale on eBay, but the prices would likely be ridiculous when you factor in freight and eBay seller charges.

It might be interesting if you could find a decent YouTube video showing how Canada handled this since they stopped producing cents in 2012.

I'll look up the Canadian alloy recovery program. Still getting Canadian cents in my rolls here in Maine 10 years after their cent was discontinued. I think those Canadian cents will re-circulate here indefinitely. Be curious to see if Canada allows private melting of the cent but I kind of bet they claim ownership of the defunct coin forever within their borders and ban it. Guess we can melt their coins here though

[Recyclersteve]

I am curious about something as I’ve never melted anything and made a bar in my life. How do you sell a bar that is 95% copper and 5% zinc as the Lincoln were up through mid-1982? Or is there a way when melting to separate the copper from the zinc?

[JerrySpringer]

I am curious about something as I’ve never melted anything and made a bar in my life. How do you sell a bar that is 95% copper and 5% zinc as the Lincoln were up through mid-1982? Or is there a way when melting to separate the copper from the zinc?

I don't know if many of us would melt the pennies. I dug up this quote though:

"Copper has a melting point of 1984.32 °F (1084.62 °C), and zinc has a melting point of 787.15 °F (419.53 °C). Because of this stark contrast in melting points, we can heat up a penny, and the zinc will become molten long before the copper does."

Guess a large-scale refiner would throw the coins into a latter stage copper ore line and have the zinc pour out? Have no clue really if it that simple. I understand aqueous and organic liquid dissolution processes and solid precipitations, but when you have mixed metals, it is impressive that a lower-melting metal would neatly liquefy out.

Most cent hoarders would just opt to sell to a refiner. I'd be skeptical of buying a backyard melted 95% Cu brick.

[Catfish4u]

Those copper pennies should sell for more of a premium! How else are individuals going to invest in physical copper/brass?

[Recyclersteve]

I am curious about something as I’ve never melted anything and made a bar in my life. How do you sell a bar that is 95% copper and 5% zinc as the Lincoln were up through mid-1982? Or is there a way when melting to separate the copper from the zinc?

I don't know if many of us would melt the pennies. I dug up this quote though:

"Copper has a melting point of 1984.32 °F (1084.62 °C), and zinc has a melting point of 787.15 °F (419.53 °C). Because of this stark contrast in melting points, we can heat up a penny, and the zinc will become molten long before the copper does."

Guess a large-scale refiner would throw the coins into a latter stage copper ore line and have the zinc pour out? Have no clue really if it that simple. I understand aqueous and organic liquid dissolution processes and solid precipitations, but when you have mixed metals, it is impressive that a lower-melting metal would neatly liquefy out.

Most cent hoarders would just opt to sell to a refiner. I'd be skeptical of buying a backyard melted 95% Cu brick.

Ok, so let’s assume zinc has a much lower melting point than copper. But, if the zinc is on the inside and coated in copper, how would you get the zinc to melt?

[Klark Cent]

It seems that if the melt value got high enough, it wouldn't matter much if the melt ban was lifted. The damn things are going to get melted.

You just couldn't sell directly to a scrapyard, and eBay or coin shops would eat into our profit. Private sales might be the thing at that point.

[DC_Penny_Guy]

1) If (when) the penny is abolished (goes out of production by act of congress), our hobby won't live very long past that date. I'd imagine that the federal reserve will stop all penny circulation promptly, and melt down the stocks. There will still be stockpiles of unsorted pennies in the wild, but they'll be few and far between.

2) The melt ban will definitely be lifted if the penny is abolished. It's an administrative regulation, not a congressional statute. Congress might not know its own ass from a hole in the ground, but career gov employees care about good policy. It will be in the nation's interest to inject some copper into the domestic commodity markets.

3) People will have a rude awakening about the scrap value of copper pennies. We all know how dirty they are, our fingers are black as soot after a 30 minute sort. Between the dirt and crud and oil stuck to every single coin, the random post-1982 zincs inevitably mixed into even the most carefully sorted hoard, and the fact that even a pristine 1960 penny contains 2.5% zinc... Scrappers will always lose a significant percentage of each melt to dross and alloy separation.

That's not even mentioning the inevitability that unscrupulous sellers will intentionally mix in a bunch of browned 1983-2008 memorial pennies to increase weight, which will make scrappers think twice about each purchase.

Considering all that, I'd guess copper pennies will go for about 85% of the rate for bare bright copper.

[Recyclersteve]

Those copper pennies should sell for more of a premium! How else are individuals going to invest in physical copper/brass?

There are other ways. For instance, digging copper wire and brass out of dumpsters from businesses such as electricians and plumbers. Also, snipping wires off of all kinds of devices with cords attached. If pennies are eliminated, I'd expect this dumpster diving activity to pick up somewhat as people get more desperate for something they are told they can't get in change anymore. Some people like to hoard what they are told they cannot have anymore. In my case, I sell the scrap copper and brass to scrap yards. In the future, perhaps I will hold onto it.

[Silver4face]

"Worst case scenarios if the penny is abolished?". This is exactly why I say BUY ROLLS NOW WHILE YOU CAN!!!!!!!!!!! By doing this, you can buy copper for face and feed the zinc to a machine and find FREE MONEY in the reject tray. Also, I do like the idea of having some copper wire or tubing on hand AS A DIVERSIFICATION, especially if you have space for this.

One more worst case scenario: We can still search nickels unless they abolish them too. To me, quarters and dimes are not searchable unless you are doing a short term project.

[DC_Penny_Guy]

It is definitely a wonderful time to be ordering penny boxes. My banks are happy to order me as many as I'd like, and I'm rarely getting any uncirculated boxes in my orders. Healthy copper percentages, too. I think people are breaking open their piggy banks. I wonder what the mintage numbers will look like at the end of the year.

[Cu Penny Hoarder]

It is definitely a wonderful time to be ordering penny boxes. My banks are happy to order me as many as I'd like, and I'm rarely getting any uncirculated boxes in my orders. Healthy copper percentages, too. I think people are breaking open their piggy banks. I wonder what the mintage numbers will look like at the end of the year.

Good for you. I stopped a few years ago, was getting too many skunk boxes.

[Recyclersteve]

Agree with DC Penny Guy that the amount of copper being received from banks is actually pretty decent. I think I’ve only had 1-2 bad boxes in the past few years.