POLL: what do YOU think we should do with the cent?

[doug]

I feel if they they quit producing the penny then it will be a long time before they allow the melting of the penny. After all like it was pointed out that there is plenty of pennies in circulation so why would they allow them to be destroyed? The same goes for the nickel too.

[uthminsta]

About aluminum: An article in a Pediatrics journal from 1981 says the following:
"In 1973 the United States Mint proposed replacing the bronze penny with a less expensive penny made of aluminum. Pediatricians and pediatric radiologists, by testifying that aluminum coins are difficult to see on radiographs, helped defeat that legislation. Now the Mint again proposes a less expensive penny, one made principally of zinc. This proposed penny is radiopaque and will be easily identified on radiographs.
Received July 22, 1981.
Accepted August 14, 1981."

I wonder how much this would affect the decision today? Is x-ray imaging able to pick aluminum up?

[maoguinn]

Kitco.com shows aluminum at .99 and zinc at .95. So, how would alum. be less expensive to be used for the cent?

[hammerrob]

I voted 'keep as is'. As long as we've got an annual budget deficit of $1 trillion +, and unfunded entitlements that can hardly be imagined, let alone calculated ... well I don't want to see any congresspersons patting themselves on the back for solving the problem of money being wasted at the mint . It's chump change .... a rounding error. It's just not where the problem is. There's got to be 10,000 more important things congress could be focusing on that are more important.

[everything]

everything wrote:We are stuck with the increment because of all the computer programs, cash registers, and 1/100th methodology behind not being able to give an accurate number without the dang thing.


I don't understand this. Do you all really think that 300 billion already-minted zinc cents will not be enough to use in daily transactions for several years, while we slowly "wean" the American public off of them?
And do you all think that we need the coin to continue to be made, in order for all those computer transactions to work?

The one cent increment is the basis or lowest transactional denomination you can go, they can't just go and cut off the 1 hundredth digit, it's a massive program rewrite for every program, operating system, everything computer/money related would have to be upgraded, way to expensive of an undertaking. Easily enough though, being computers and codable they could modify code to round up/down and/or file those cents away into another account, but they would still have to do something with them.

I thought maybe we could pay down the deficit one cent at a time this way but no way.

[Z00]

I think the cost of production added to the cost of ANY metal will make the total cost higher than 1 cent.

The only way to lessen the cost would be to reduce the size of the planchet.

Look at the sizes of some other country's lowest denomination coins. The 1 gram aluminum Japanese Yen for example.

[uthminsta]

Kitco.com shows aluminum at .99 and zinc at .95. So, how would alum. be less expensive to be used for the cent?

The only way to lessen the cost would be to reduce the size of the planchet.

Not plating it would lower the cost. Just plain aluminum - and no pretense that it's the same as it always was.
But also shrinking it? Hmmm... Hadn't considered that.

There's got to be 10,000 more important things congress could be focusing on that are more important.

Yes, there are. But I wanna focus on this one. And thank GOD, I'm not a congressman!!!

The one cent increment is the basis or lowest transactional denomination you can go, they can't just go and cut off the 1 hundredth digit, it's a massive program rewrite for every program, operating system, everything computer/money related would have to be upgraded, way to expensive of an undertaking.

I see what you're saying, but I STILL don't see why ceasing production of the cent would make these rewrites necessary. It needn't be demonetized, just stop making it. All the transactions could still be done as they were before.

[uthminsta]

This begs the question: how long after the end of production of the half cent (1857) were transactions still carried out including half cents?

[Z00]

Another thought.

The Guatamala 1 centavo is 19mm vs the US cent @ 19.05mm
It is .985 aluminum and .015 magnesium wt = 0.8 gram.
Not sure how the thickness compares.

So you could have close to the same size. However would that change total cost considering production cost.

(side note)
1 lb = 576 centavos. At the current exchange rate that would cost 74 cents. What would .985 Al bring at the scrap yard? LOL

[uthminsta]

Turn your old beer cans into cash! Literally!

[DebtFreeMe]

Although I voted to end it now, what I really mean is after I have put together several tons for myself... Then end the penny

[uthminsta]

Here's what I think will happen:

[Hawkeye]

I think they should make the penny out of copper, the nickel out of nickel, the dime, quarter, half dollar and dollar out of silver. The 5, 10, and 20 dollar bills should be redeemable in silver, and the 50 and 100 redeemable in gold. (also throw in a 50 and 100 dollar gold coin for good measure). Wait... was I daydreaming again? Sorry.

I would say lose the penny, make the nickel cheaper and lose the dollar bill. But only after I enlarge my hoard.

[uthminsta]

This begs the question: how long after the end of production of the half cent (1857) were transactions still carried out including half cents?

Just realized the answer to this question, at least in part, is this:
These 5 stamps were issued from 1956-1961. They were used for some time. This was a century after the discontinuation of the denomination. In my opinion, that means - at least on a certain scale - that transactions of a certain amount were possible without the coin being minted.

[Hawkeye]

This begs the question: how long after the end of production of the half cent (1857) were transactions still carried out including half cents?

Just realized the answer to this question, at least in part, is this:
These 5 stamps were issued from 1956-1961. They were used for some time. This was a century after the discontinuation of the denomination. In my opinion, that means - at least on a certain scale - that transactions of a certain amount were possible without the coin being minted.

I had never thought of it like that before. Great point! Maybe we could keep the penny the same, but make it worth 2 1/2 cents - a "half-nickel." Who knows. Interesting topic.

[cesariojpn]

This begs the question: how long after the end of production of the half cent (1857) were transactions still carried out including half cents?

Just realized the answer to this question, at least in part, is this:
These 5 stamps were issued from 1956-1961. They were used for some time. This was a century after the discontinuation of the denomination. In my opinion, that means - at least on a certain scale - that transactions of a certain amount were possible without the coin being minted.

Actually, if you look into Revenue Stamps, it get's even more weirder.

Observe, the Potato Tax Revenue Stamps of 1935....which were never implemented.



Of course, if you REALLY want to have a brain cramp, many Proprietary Revenue Stamps went into some truly bizarre fractions.


http://1898revenues.blogspot.com/2011/1 ... -c-co.html
http://1898revenues.blogspot.com/search ... %20Company
http://1898revenues.blogspot.com/search ... 0Drug%20Co.
http://1898revenues.blogspot.com/search ... d%20Hereth

[TwoAndAHalfCents]

I had never thought of it like that before. Great point! Maybe we could keep the penny the same, but make it worth 2 1/2 cents - a "half-nickel." Who knows. Interesting topic.

Not a "half nickel". Try "quarter dime". But that's just my 2 1/2 cents.

[mflugher]

I don't feel like finding some pics and figuring out how to link them, if someone wants to get on that feel free and it would be appreciated...
but you may be interested to look into sales tax tokens, these were minted as recently as the 40s, the problem being states wanted to collect their 4 to 7 pct sales tax, but candy bars cost 5cents, how does one calculate sales tax on a 10 c candy bar? by giving change in sales tax tokens worth 1/10th 1/5 and 1/2 cents... that way you could pay your 11 cents, get a 1/2 cent sales tax token back and next time you buy for 10c and the 1/2c sales tax token left over from your previous purchase, of course the merchant would send the sales tax reciepts to the bank in dollars and cents, not silly tokens...


I have like 3 of these I bought recently they are kinda cool, but not worth that much 2 to 3 bucks each. made of aluminum, copper or steel...

honestly there should have been an option 4. revalue the currency and keep the penny... lopping a 10 off the equation would make things much easier, they could confiscate all the copper coinage, melt it, recast it into new coins and make a profit...

[uthminsta]

lopping a 10 off the equation would make things much easier

YIKES!

[creshka46]

Another thought.

The Guatamala 1 centavo is 19mm vs the US cent @ 19.05mm
It is .985 aluminum and .015 magnesium wt = 0.8 gram.
Not sure how the thickness compares.

So you could have close to the same size. However would that change total cost considering production cost.

(side note)
1 lb = 576 centavos. At the current exchange rate that would cost 74 cents. What would .985 Al bring at the scrap yard? LOL

Another option would be to put a hole in the middle. That could potentially make them a little more convenient too. They could also make for good washers

[fb101]

Let's return it to the pre-1982 composition.
It will make hoarding a lot easier.

[hobo finds]

I don't feel like finding some pics and figuring out how to link them, if someone wants to get on that feel free and it would be appreciated...
but you may be interested to look into sales tax tokens, these were minted as recently as the 40s, the problem being states wanted to collect their 4 to 7 pct sales tax, but candy bars cost 5cents, how does one calculate sales tax on a 10 c candy bar? by giving change in sales tax tokens worth 1/10th 1/5 and 1/2 cents... that way you could pay your 11 cents, get a 1/2 cent sales tax token back and next time you buy for 10c and the 1/2c sales tax token left over from your previous purchase, of course the merchant would send the sales tax reciepts to the bank in dollars and cents, not silly tokens...


I have like 3 of these I bought recently they are kinda cool, but not worth that much 2 to 3 bucks each. made of aluminum, copper or steel...

honestly there should have been an option 4. revalue the currency and keep the penny... lopping a 10 off the equation would make things much easier, they could confiscate all the copper coinage, melt it, recast it into new coins and make a profit...

http://taxtoken.org/faq.htm

[cupronickel]

I would vote for dropping one zero off of all banknotes, while keeping coinage the same.
You would have to replace all of your bank notes with new ones at 10 old = 1 new.
But all coins would retain their face value.

[AGgressive Metal]

The Proprietary stamps being in 8ths of a cent is not as bizarre as it first sounds. Stocks were trading in eighths and sixteenths of a dollar in the US from the opening of the stock market until April 9, 2001. The reason was based on the Spanish dollar (aka Pieces of Eight, aka 8 Reales) which was divided into eighths. Price increments were measured by sixteenths of a dollar, or 6.25 cents. When a stock price rose "one and 5/8ths" it meant the price had risen $1 plus 5/8ths of a dollar (or about $1.62). The "dollar" that is referred to in the Constitution is this Spanish Dollar, since the US Mint did not exist for several years after the document was written and there was no US Dollar as such.

Suggested reading: "Pieces of Eight : The Monetary Powers and Disabilities of the United States Constitution" by Dr. Edwin Vieira Jr. (warning, its over 1,500 pages and costs about $200 or $800 depending on the edition).

[Copper]

I think the real question is, "WHEN will they stop making them?" It's only a matter of time. It will get real insteresting becuase I believe that merchants that have been locked in the price of whatever and 99 cents to make it seem cheaper will be reluctant to change. For a period of time, places like fast food joints will be fine but as the cents gradually get pulled out of circulation, what do they do? Increase prices by $.01 and fight that "higher dollar stigma" or drop everthing by $.04? A $.99 hamburger is a lot cheaper than $1 one, isn't it?

Depends if that one cent is copper or not;)