Is anyone in the scrap metal to refiner business?

[TXBullion]

I was trying to find general information on the business side of the scrap metal after it comes into the center. Where does it go? What kind of pricing are the scrap yards getting? What kind of quantity minimums are there? shipping to a local refinery or cross country? What kind of minimums do you have to do to justify the operation? Biggest expenses, most profitable items etc.....

I would greatly appreciate info if anyone has experience/knowledge regarding it.

Thanks!

[hobo finds]

I have been thinking about ABS plastic and CRT's not anywhere close to me to scraps them. More and more older TV's and computers are being replaced. This waste stream is recyclable and I think you could make some money on it. People have been worried about CRT's but somewhere I found the EPA has no longer listed them as hazardous. I will find the info and post it...

http://www.epa.gov/osw/hazard/recycling ... t-fs06.htm

[TXBullion]

What is CRT?

[hobo finds]

The tube form monitors and TV's. Cathode ray tube

[mtldealer]

What type of scrap metal are you interested in hearing about?

[TXBullion]

What type of scrap metal are you interested in hearing about?

More in general terms, but examples would be copper, steel, iron, nickel, aluminum.
I also have an interest in other things such as paper cardboard, glass but it sounds like as sole items, they may not be viable.

[Robarons]

I know in my town all the scrap yards are clustered together in the industrial park area near railway lines. This allows the yards to be competitive but far away if you dont live near this cluster.

So some guy opened a small operation across town- small plot of land with a shack and scale. He bought iron and normal metals and it seems he contracted them out to one of the larger scrap yards in the industrial area. He paid less, but he made more than the difference up in the convenience of his location capturing people who would have never scrapped at all to the distance and by opening more hours- on Saturday and even Sunday for a while. When he collected enough in bulk of each metal one of the larger yards paid him a commercial price to make it worth while.

But it seems being close to railroad tracks and being able to contact semi's to haul metal away seems to be key recipe. My town had 70,000 GM workers in 1979 and was one time a huge industrial hub, but by 1995 they laid off 62,000 workers, so these yards are using an infrastructure left behind by GM.

[TXBullion]

I know in my town all the scrap yards are clustered together in the industrial park area near railway lines. This allows the yards to be competitive but far away if you dont live near this cluster.

So some guy opened a small operation across town- small plot of land with a shack and scale. He bought iron and normal metals and it seems he contracted them out to one of the larger scrap yards in the industrial area. He paid less, but he made more than the difference up in the convenience of his location capturing people who would have never scrapped at all to the distance and by opening more hours- on Saturday and even Sunday for a while. When he collected enough in bulk of each metal one of the larger yards paid him a commercial price to make it worth while.

But it seems being close to railroad tracks and being able to contact semi's to haul metal away seems to be key recipe. My town had 70,000 GM workers in 1979 and was one time a huge industrial hub, but by 1995 they laid off 62,000 workers, so these yards are using an infrastructure left behind by GM.

Great info! That makes a lot of sense

Keep them coming

Perhaps if they bundle their material they receive a better payout as well

[natsb88]

The yard I use actually melts down all of their aluminum into big pallet-sized ingots with a waste oil burner (they keep it full with all the scrap cars coming in and an auto body / service station they also run).

When cars come in, they set them up on a rack and drain all the fluids into separate tanks. They used to just hack them up with shears. They purchased a baler since I was there last, but I don't know if it's big enough for cars or not. The steel just gets hauled off in 40' dump trucks, so I'm not entirely sure where they go with it. I don't think they do any processing outside of their yard, so they must sell it to a bigger place.

They bail plastic, newspaper, magazines, and corrugated. Some of that gets shipped right to China.

[TXBullion]

Wonder where it all goes? Individual metal refineries ? Black hole? China? Wonder ho the big buyers are of this stuff...... Hoard weren't you guys selling card board BTT for a while ?

[mtldealer]

In Los Angeles it is easier to sell metal to china than back east. Most of the scrap ends up at one of a couple places that specialize in that particular metal. Ie... Stainless unless your exporting it yourself ends up at 1 of 3 places I know of. These 3 yards consolidate their scrap and sell it overseas... Overseas is probably a mill that melts it into new ingot/blooms for new metal. 1 company I deal with specializes in blending metals. They get asked for a particular breakdown of metal, their job is to blend a load to the mills specs. Ie... Stainless Steel 18/8 - 18% chromium and 8% nickel. As long as when they are done that is what the percentages are it doesn't make a difference whether they start with used 18/8 or take pure nickel and mix other elements to get to their composition. In Aluminum we have a couple of smelters here and they are buying scrap from the yards to spec also. You cant make 5052 Aluminum from using MLC but you can make 5052 from melting 1100. The chemistry involved is where the metallurgists come in.
In the end... the scrap metal business is extremely hard to get into and then to maintain. The machinery cost are LARGE. the bankroll is usually HUGE.
I always took for granted business on a handshake. I watched my grandfather do it and my dad.
A couple of years ago I called one of the yards in town and sold them 6063 Aluminum approx 40,000# at the time the price was .90 cents a pound. $36K - He said ship it to my yard. My driver would usually wait for a check but on this friday, the owner said he would drop it off on the way home. The check never came. That Monday I found out that he was out of business. He had declared bankruptcy. When they auctioned off his property/stuff months later he complained how things weren't being sold for high enough. He knowingly screwed many people out of millions of dollars. He doesnt care. He opened another business a couple months later under his brothers name... I think. I digressed... anyways
I have a document that I wanted to upload for you guys to look at. What is the best way to do it? Its a PDF.

[hobo finds]

I too, thought most of it went out of country to be processed... Why can't we have plants here to do this? Seems a lot cheaper to re purpose plastic and cardboard here than to ship it all the way to China! Most cities have household recycling programs where does that stuff go?

[TXBullion]

thanks mtldealer . When you refer to the cost of the machinery can you specify? baler, fork lift, dozer? I have only seen a couple of small yards ...

[fasteddy]

Midlothian Texas...a very large steel mill that shreds scrap steel including automobiles...it is amazing to watch a crushed car go through the shredder. i once did some work at at cogen plant in North Andover MA...they burned trash to produce electricity...I was working near the conveyor belt dumping the metals that didnt burn in the process. We need more of those cogen units but they are pricey to maintain.

[HoardCopperByTheTon]

Wonder where it all goes? Individual metal refineries ? Black hole? China? Wonder ho the big buyers are of this stuff...... Hoard weren't you guys selling card board BTT for a while ?

I have been known to sell a bale or 2 of cardboard now and then. Just sold another 20 tons this morning.. price was up $2 a ton! Being near a port is even better than being near a rail line.


We occasionally sell a little aluminum and other metals too. That is usually processed domestically.

[AdamsSamoa]

I always thought that it would be a cool post-Army occupation.

[chris6084]

I know in one Texas city, all of the recyclers take plastic. They ALL sell their plastic to a large nationwide recycler that has a location there. They shred all of the plastic, melt it into pellets and ship it to Mexico.