Prepping For the Silver Shortage

[neilgin1]

I'd buy 370 of these:

http://www.monarchpreciousmetals.com/in ... &Itemid=53

db23 had a couple of rolls of these for sale a few months back. I don't remember them ever selling.

I am waiting for delivery of mine. (not 370 tho. LOL)

how long?

[68Camaro]

one more thing on my heart, why is it, that guys here, all that I really like, are starting to talk about leaving America...

Can't speak for anyone but myself but a) I talk big but odds of acting on it are slim, b) there isn't anywhere else I would go unless this country becomes death to Christians and the choice is leave or the family dies, c) I don't like to box myself in and don't want to accumulate a set of assets that can't be transported, at least in part, should b) happen.

[ZenOps]

Its not all about abandoning the US, its also about being able to use metals to actually buy things:

Export restrictions will become a factor.

It is currently illegal to transport more than $100 worth of pennies or nickels out of the US at one time (Five year jail term possible)

All the US has to do, is make the law illegal to transport more than $100 worth of silver or gold by weight out of the country and it changes the rules significantly. If you had to buy say - two barrels of oil to survive every day, but could only use gold and silver, you might not be able to get your two barrels with those types of restrictions.

If Canada required that the US paid Canada solely in nickels for oil, the US would run out of nickels in about 10 days.

So in essence, its important to know the limits that can be imposed by governments. Like Hong Kong and each person only being allowed a certain amount of milk, regardless of how much money you have.

BTW: There currently is no restriction on gold and silver, but there is on face value nickel and copper... Dun dun duhhhh.

[Engineer]

Its not all about abandoning the US, its also about being able to use metals to actually buy things

To me, it's a simple matter of being able to hide and/or personally carry my stack. Whether it's due to SHTF, mandatory evacuations, or simply transporting metals from one location to another, having either too much weight or too large a volume is disadvantageous.

[OneBiteAtATime]

how long?

Monarch only sells what they have in stock. if you order with a credit card today, you should have it by the end of the week. if you pay by check you have to wait until it gets to them first. then they ship.

[OneBiteAtATime]

how long?

Monarch only sells what they have in stock. if you order with a credit card today, you should have it by the end of the week. if you pay by check you have to wait until it gets to them first. then they ship.

Last time I ordered, they got payment in the 23rd, and shipped on the 24th.

[ZenOps]

True enough, but again... Beware possible border restrictions (and also border confiscations if you try to transport too much in one shot)

Germany asked for its gold back from the US, and they will of course be getting it back - At a rate of about 165 pounds per day. Germany, even as a country does not have the ability to neogotiate for more than about 7 standard 25 pound goodbars of gold each day. Would they prefer all of their gold in one or two shipments instead of over a ten year period? Probably, but thats just not going to happen.

The US export restriction of 22 pounds of cupronickel and 68.5 pounds of copper in US coinage form should not be taken lightly. It is no stretch at all to put an export restriction of say 10 ounces of silver and 1/10th of an ounce of gold per person.

One should not forget the 1974 export restriction of $1 worth of copper pennies out of the US. And if they can do that, gold may not be as transportable as you might think it is (you are much better off storing the wealth in strategic locations around the world, instead of trying to run with it)

In Canada, we are currently deciding whether or not to jail some police officers trying to smuggle cheese from the US far above the border restriction limits.

http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/story/201 ... tions.html

BTW: The 1/10th ounce gold seems to be a reasonable amount to transport per day. If the US government were to set a personal export restriction, it would most likely be 1/10th per day. Which might explain why there is such a premium on coins of that size. The ultra rich may have already been tipped off that 1/10th is the magic amount - now theres a conspiracy theory for you.

And: Canada is a net exporter of gold, we don't want no stinking gold. We want milk, just like Hong Kong.

[IdahoCopper]

one more thing on my heart, why is it, that guys here, all that I really like, are starting to talk about leaving America?

i'm NOT judging anybody...i'm really not....but are we gonna left these screwheads, grab grey grimy dreary men, drive US from OUR country?

just the thought of THAT, makes me angry...My heart, my blood is in this land. All my life I been searching for my bit of land, grew up for my first 7 years in rural America, then dragged to the city....then live in urban rentals for the next 21 years...then lived in an exurban rental outside LA for 18 years.....now FINALLY I got my land in the Great White North, my America....and they're going to make me feel like I gotta "flee"?

why?....I've done nothing wrong......I know "they're" wrong...the way "they" do things, these "powers that be", shiteheads the whole lot of them, but I aint going nowhere.

this place?...I don't know whether its "Bag End"...or "Edoras"......I know I post too many film clips, i'm sorry, its just my '"language" and I know this is just a "story"....but i'm not fleeing....two clips, I hope they speak to you all....what kind of men are we, if we forget the blood of our forefathers shed to defend this land? that we let small men drive us from our land? two clips....and I got me a nice proof roll of 1959 Proof Washingtons's!!!

Brother Neil,

Many years ago I was working on a job with a guy who had worked installing security equipment in many US embassies. He told me of an experience where he was standing on the embassy balcony in a African city. He looked out over the ancient city and saw a small column of dark black smoke rising from an intersection. He asked the marine guard, what it was. The marine told him, "They caught a thief". Apparently when a thief is caught, the citizens stack old tires over him to the top of his head, douse him with petrol and torch him.

The country you reminisce on and adore is long gone. It was killed by thieves and voter apathy. What remains is a mere husk, running on inertia, until its final death convulsions. When those convulsions peak, I plan to be outta here, hopefully sailing the wide, blue South Pacific to visit tranquil isles.

The "grey grimy dreary men" you speak of are the puppets of the puppet masters. Those shills hold the reins of power in your beloved country. They are re-elected again and again by the rotted sheeple, who buy into their lies of more free stuff for the downtrodden, forever. All the while the 10,000 or so puppet masters shear the entire flock of its once golden fleeces, and carry that wealth off to their hidden lairs.

Only when 10,000 columns of dense black smoke arise, on the same day, in cities around the world, will we ever be free again. I am not a seer, but in my gut, I do not think that scene will ever happen, not even in a movie.

As for me, I presently window shop for a sailing yacht, working towards and hoping that one day my meager business will finally yield a windfall large enough to extract myself from landlubber status, and restore my place on the open sea, the only place where freedom remains.

[68Camaro]

...
When those convulsions peak, I plan to be outta here, hopefully sailing the wide, blue South Pacific to visit tranquil isles.
...
As for me, I presently window shop for a sailing yacht, working towards and hoping that one day my meager business will finally yield a windfall large enough to extract myself from landlubber status, and restore my place on the open sea, the only place where freedom remains.

If the US does go down as you believe and many fear, there will be no "tranquil isles" anywhere and the ocean will be an especially fearful place with pirates galore running around, so good luck with your plan. Unfortunately in the real world we live there is no remote place left for John Galt to re-start a new society.

[IdahoCopper]

...
When those convulsions peak, I plan to be outta here, hopefully sailing the wide, blue South Pacific to visit tranquil isles.
...
As for me, I presently window shop for a sailing yacht, working towards and hoping that one day my meager business will finally yield a windfall large enough to extract myself from landlubber status, and restore my place on the open sea, the only place where freedom remains.

If the US does go down as you believe and many fear, there will be no "tranquil isles" anywhere and the ocean will be an especially fearful place with pirates galore running around, so good luck with your plan. Unfortunately in the real world we live there is no remote place left for John Galt to re-start a new society.

Apparently you have not been-there-done-that as I have. I have sailed across from California to Panama, to Australia. The small, out of the way islands in the SoPac are filled with happy people, living in a simpler time. If you can be satisfied to retire on fish and coconuts, with an occasional bottle of rum, life can be very good, in the surf and the shade of swaying palms.

[Lemon Thrower]

eventually as the dollar dies there will be export controls - you won't be able to transfer any wealth out of the country, whether gold, silver, or currency.

you can try to get ahead of that by buying real assets overseas. goldmoney is an example. whether that will work in the long run remains to be seen. some folks are buying foreign real estate, but that is as likely to go south sooner than keeping your money here. Casey for example has for a decade been pumping Argentina. however, their currency has gone backwards.

i think a mix of silver and gold are good. i expect to trade silver for gold at a better ratio in the future.

[IdahoCopper]

eventually as the dollar dies there will be export controls - you won't be able to transfer any wealth out of the country, whether gold, silver, or currency.

you can try to get ahead of that by buying real assets overseas. goldmoney is an example. whether that will work in the long run remains to be seen. some folks are buying foreign real estate, but that is as likely to go south sooner than keeping your money here. Casey for example has for a decade been pumping Argentina. however, their currency has gone backwards.

i think a mix of silver and gold are good. i expect to trade silver for gold at a better ratio in the future.

Bitcoins are an option to export controls. Convert all the assets, get on a plane, and in the destination country, convert them back to whatever you want; Euros, pesos, Ag or Au. Just don't leave them as Bitcoins for too long, and you won't loose too much.

Ingots in the bilge is another option. Private boats leaving the US are not searched, and the captain doesn't even need to tell anyone the boat not coming back.

[neilgin1]

one more thing on my heart, why is it, that guys here, all that I really like, are starting to talk about leaving America?

i'm NOT judging anybody...i'm really not....but are we gonna left these screwheads, grab grey grimy dreary men, drive US from OUR country?

just the thought of THAT, makes me angry...My heart, my blood is in this land. All my life I been searching for my bit of land, grew up for my first 7 years in rural America, then dragged to the city....then live in urban rentals for the next 21 years...then lived in an exurban rental outside LA for 18 years.....now FINALLY I got my land in the Great White North, my America....and they're going to make me feel like I gotta "flee"?

why?....I've done nothing wrong......I know "they're" wrong...the way "they" do things, these "powers that be", shiteheads the whole lot of them, but I aint going nowhere.

this place?...I don't know whether its "Bag End"...or "Edoras"......I know I post too many film clips, i'm sorry, its just my '"language" and I know this is just a "story"....but i'm not fleeing....two clips, I hope they speak to you all....what kind of men are we, if we forget the blood of our forefathers shed to defend this land? that we let small men drive us from our land? two clips....and I got me a nice proof roll of 1959 Proof Washingtons's!!!

Brother Neil,

Many years ago I was working on a job with a guy who had worked installing security equipment in many US embassies. He told me of an experience where he was standing on the embassy balcony in a African city. He looked out over the ancient city and saw a small column of dark black smoke rising from an intersection. He asked the marine guard, what it was. The marine told him, "They caught a thief". Apparently when a thief is caught, the citizens stack old tires over him to the top of his head, douse him with petrol and torch him.

The country you reminisce on and adore is long gone. It was killed by thieves and voter apathy. What remains is a mere husk, running on inertia, until its final death convulsions. When those convulsions peak, I plan to be outta here, hopefully sailing the wide, blue South Pacific to visit tranquil isles.

The "grey grimy dreary men" you speak of are the puppets of the puppet masters. Those shills hold the reins of power in your beloved country. They are re-elected again and again by the rotted sheeple, who buy into their lies of more free stuff for the downtrodden, forever. All the while the 10,000 or so puppet masters shear the entire flock of its once golden fleeces, and carry that wealth off to their hidden lairs.

Only when 10,000 columns of dense black smoke arise, on the same day, in cities around the world, will we ever be free again. I am not a seer, but in my gut, I do not think that scene will ever happen, not even in a movie.

As for me, I presently window shop for a sailing yacht, working towards and hoping that one day my meager business will finally yield a windfall large enough to extract myself from landlubber status, and restore my place on the open sea, the only place where freedom remains.

my good ole bro Idaho,
we had the good occasion to touch base via telephone, laughing and joking....get a handle on the other guy, you and that was good. You can always tell when you're talking to someone of similar outlook.

Freedom is just that; Freedom. Which means if it takes its form in a sailboat on the open seas for you...I stand behind that, and bear NO ILL WILL. How could I?!? That's YOUR vision, and in Liberty I respect and uplift it....you know that!

My vision is by Liberty or Death, I stay, and in true respect, I disagree, all hope is NOT LOST. Even the Brits, with their monarchy, in their darkest hours, hung on...the words of ONE MAN, Sir Winston Churchill, to rally a nation that had been asleep too long. There foes were external, ours are internal, which is different. But all tyrants ALWAYS overplay their hand, and they will, and when they do, they will re-awaken this Good Land from its slumber, and that will be the undoing of these traitors, and maybe one man with a clear voice and vision will rally a sleeping nation, in Liberty and in Freedom. Not a murderous demagogue like a hitler, appealing to people's basest instincts, but a man, guided by the Constitution, the Bill of Rights, and making a full thoarted appeal to Liberty, and the Republic.

it all becomes as thus, because we have no choice

[theo]

...
When those convulsions peak, I plan to be outta here, hopefully sailing the wide, blue South Pacific to visit tranquil isles.
...
As for me, I presently window shop for a sailing yacht, working towards and hoping that one day my meager business will finally yield a windfall large enough to extract myself from landlubber status, and restore my place on the open sea, the only place where freedom remains.

If the US does go down as you believe and many fear, there will be no "tranquil isles" anywhere and the ocean will be an especially fearful place with pirates galore running around, so good luck with your plan. Unfortunately in the real world we live there is no remote place left for John Galt to re-start a new society.

Apparently you have not been-there-done-that as I have. I have sailed across from California to Panama, to Australia. The small, out of the way islands in the SoPac are filled with happy people, living in a simpler time. If you can be satisfied to retire on fish and coconuts, with an occasional bottle of rum, life can be very good, in the surf and the shade of swaying palms.

If it gets so bad that life in the U.S. becomes untenable, much of the rest of the world will follow suit. Most of these small islands have seen several fold population increases over the past few generations due to modern technology and supplies from overseas, which will become less reliable or stop altogether during a worldwide collapse. The expanded populations can not be supported by fish and coconuts.

And that is assuming you make it there at all. While your travel and sailing experience sound impressive, I don't believe it would prepare you for a post-collapse sea travel. You should not dismiss Camaro's warning about piracy

[ZenOps]

I'm not so sure that a lot of islands are dependant on the US.

Much like in the physical US, everything including Ramen noodles and the shipping lanes all come from Asia now no matter where you are in the world. As long as the little island has a few solar panels (made in China) you can power up your made in Taiwan HDTV and satellite reciever, use your 8-gram copper or nickel dollars to buy a coffee and doughnut every morning and its all good.

If you want to "nuke" the island, the US is a better choice, but to actually be able to eat on it - China is more important.

BTW: Just got my Sacagawea 2013's in.. Surprisingly appealing design, arguably just as sexy as the loonie or bears on the toonies, while I find the new US $100 to be the ugliest thing I've ever seen.

Conspiracy.

BTW: Copper and nickel are in many ways, anti-theft because of their weight. Almost no theif will bother to break and enter into a house to say - take $2,000 worth of pennies. Would any pirate bother to waste a few hundred gallons of fuel to take a copper or nickel dollar (or pennies and nickels)? No of course not, they go after the paper. Yet 8-grams of copper and/or nickel is still enough to keep a local economy running for day to day transactions.

Gold, pssshhh.... You don't want gold on a paradise island.

[mflugher]

Certainly something to consider... thinking outside the box there, good on ya

BUT... isn't DeBeers just the opposite of JPMorgan? Keeping prices artificially high by suppressing release of what is reportedly millions of carats from reaching the markets? I read some marketing stuff from the sixties and seventies about how they popularized diamonds with women (good reading btw) and how there are huge diamond fields in Russia... but that a diamond cartel keeps prices artificially high by only permitting a trickle of stones into the market each year. Is this an urban myth?

Diamonds... good thought, but my problem with diamonds is that they are made from a common element carbon and can be synthesized, and even the natural diamonds aren't actually rare, just made artificially scarce and the desire ramped up for women by the cartel(s). There are faux diamonds that are as attractive (if not more so) like moissonite.

I don't know that DeBeers is controlling the market on colored diamonds or not. Maybe regular diamonds. I'm sure it's more than possible.

Additionally yes, just like there are fake silver EVERYTHING now days, there are fake diamonds. Should we not all buy from reputable individuals? It is the same with colored diamonds. But, neither the risk of having JP Morgan manipulate the market down nor the risk of buying fake silver stops us from doing what we think is the right thing to do.

Heck, having US FRNs is a risk. The idea we can use colored diamonds as a more concentrated store of value or wealth, is easily transported, and purchase need not be reported is out there. Colored diamonds should be a consideration for those who have proportions of metals that serve them yet want to spread their risk via diversification and proportioning.

Additional food for thought: According to International Living, May 2013, the largest pink diamond ever uncovered in Australia (named the Argyle Pink Jubilee) was donated by Rio Tinto to the Melbourne Museum. The 8.01 carat pink diamond was valued pre-auction at $10 - $20 million. Rio Tinto's Argyle mine accounts for 90% of the world's pink diamond supply and is expected to be exhausted by 2019.

The Rapaport Diamond Trade Index (RAPI) is derived from the average asking price from the top 25 best-quality one carat diamonds. Down 12.5% for 2012 rising slightly ytd 2013. See: http://www.pricescope.com/diamond-search-results for colored diamond pricing.

As someone who deals in diamonds regularly, I wouldn't try to use them as a store of wealth. Too much spread between buy and sell. That slightly under 1ct dia. yellow could be worth $200 or $4000 wholesale...

Also someone who hasn't dealt extensively with diamonds I'd bet your $5k investment would more likely net you the $500 diamond before the $4k diamond.


So to prevent this sort of problem remember:

1. Rappaport price lists are Retail prices, wholesale is usually at least 50% back of Rappaport sometimes as much as 70%, however some high end dias go as much as 35 to 40% back of Rapp.
2. I would invest only in a GIA graded and serialed diamond as a layman. This way you can verify it is in fact the diamond described in the report.
3. I would suggest you still have a diamond expert review it before buying.


If you are going to invest in diamonds keep in mind you could be investing in high end Numis, baseball cards, stamps etc as well. They are luxury items, as opposed to precious metals which are money.

BTW if anyone wants a diamond let me know, I will get you a good deal compared to any jewelry store.

I happen to have available at this time:

a 2.25 ct yellow round $7500
a 4.37 ct Light fancy yellow Pear $45k

[shinnosuke]

Zerohedge has a sobering article about the likelihood of offshore tax havens no longer being so. It's getting harder to be financially invisible.

http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2013-05-0 ... ore-wealth

[johnbrickner]

I don't know that DeBeers is controlling the market on colored diamonds or not. Maybe regular diamonds. I'm sure it's more than possible.

Additionally yes, just like there are fake silver EVERYTHING now days, there are fake diamonds. Should we not all buy from reputable individuals? It is the same with colored diamonds. But, neither the risk of having JP Morgan manipulate the market down nor the risk of buying fake silver stops us from doing what we think is the right thing to do.

Heck, having US FRNs is a risk. The idea we can use colored diamonds as a more concentrated store of value or wealth, is easily transported, and purchase need not be reported is out there. Colored diamonds should be a consideration for those who have proportions of metals that serve them yet want to spread their risk via diversification and proportioning.

Additional food for thought: According to International Living, May 2013, the largest pink diamond ever uncovered in Australia (named the Argyle Pink Jubilee) was donated by Rio Tinto to the Melbourne Museum. The 8.01 carat pink diamond was valued pre-auction at $10 - $20 million. Rio Tinto's Argyle mine accounts for 90% of the world's pink diamond supply and is expected to be exhausted by 2019.

The Rapaport Diamond Trade Index (RAPI) is derived from the average asking price from the top 25 best-quality one carat diamonds. Down 12.5% for 2012 rising slightly ytd 2013. See: http://www.pricescope.com/diamond-search-results for colored diamond pricing.

As someone who deals in diamonds regularly, I wouldn't try to use them as a store of wealth. Too much spread between buy and sell. That slightly under 1ct dia. yellow could be worth $200 or $4000 wholesale...

Also someone who hasn't dealt extensively with diamonds I'd bet your $5k investment would more likely net you the $500 diamond before the $4k diamond.


So to prevent this sort of problem remember:

1. Rappaport price lists are Retail prices, wholesale is usually at least 50% back of Rappaport sometimes as much as 70%, however some high end dias go as much as 35 to 40% back of Rapp.
2. I would invest only in a GIA graded and serialed diamond as a layman. This way you can verify it is in fact the diamond described in the report.
3. I would suggest you still have a diamond expert review it before buying.


If you are going to invest in diamonds keep in mind you could be investing in high end Numis, baseball cards, stamps etc as well. They are luxury items, as opposed to precious metals which are money.

BTW if anyone wants a diamond let me know, I will get you a good deal compared to any jewelry store.

I happen to have available at this time:

a 2.25 ct yellow round $7500
a 4.37 ct Light fancy yellow Pear $45k

And THAT is why I like this forum. TY mflugher for your wise words!

[Mossy]

All the US has to do, is make the law illegal to transport more than $100 worth of silver or gold by weight out of the country and it changes the rules significantly. If you had to buy say - two barrels of oil to survive every day, but could only use gold and silver, you might not be able to get your two barrels with those types of restrictions.

The US fedgov can ban crossing a state line with something easily enough. "Interstate commerce".

[Mossy]

As for me, I presently window shop for a sailing yacht, working towards and hoping that one day my meager business will finally yield a windfall large enough to extract myself from landlubber status, and restore my place on the open sea, the only place where freedom remains.

You have to figure how to get veggies. I've read about people trying to garden on some of those islands and getting wiped out by crabs eating the produce. I don't know how the Polynesians got their greens.

[johnbrickner]

The Below taken from: http://dollarcollapse.com/inflation/inf ... e-to-look/

Most expensive diamond ever sold goes for $83.2M
Sotheby’s just dropped the hammer on the most expensive diamond ever sold. The stone, a 59.6-carat flawless pink diamond called the “Pink Star,” was auctioned for $83.2 million, according to Sotheby’s. That made it the most expensive jewel or diamond ever sold at auction.

The previous record for a diamond sold at auction was $46 million, for a 24.68-carat pink diamond bought by Laurence Graff in 2010. The auction follows yesterday’s Christie’s sale of the largest fancy-vivid orange diamond known to exist, a 14.82-carat stone that sold for $36 million—the highest price-per-carat ever paid at auction.

If you couple the above with this:

China's wealthy also are pouring money into collectibles and art. Billionaire Wang Jianlin and his company Dalian Wanda last month bought a Picasso at a Christie's auction for $28 million. Bidding from Chinese buyers was strong throughout the auctions, according to dealers and gallerists.

It's also going to wine and diamonds. Diamond dealers say more than half of today's collectible diamonds are going to Chinese buyers. And on Saturday, the world's most expensive case of wine—1978 Romanée-Conti—sold in Hong Kong for $476,000.

from http://www.cnbc.com/id/101225781

One could conclude that while diamonds and colored diamonds may not be a good long term store of value or "investment," they can be a very concentrated store of wealth that can be easily be transported to a safer place. Again, sales of which are not reportable. Someone out there wants these things and is willing to dump a ton of cash on them. They should not be discounted from consideration.

[beauanderos]

The Below taken from: http://dollarcollapse.com/inflation/inf ... e-to-look/

Most expensive diamond ever sold goes for $83.2M
Sotheby’s just dropped the hammer on the most expensive diamond ever sold. The stone, a 59.6-carat flawless pink diamond called the “Pink Star,” was auctioned for $83.2 million, according to Sotheby’s. That made it the most expensive jewel or diamond ever sold at auction.

The previous record for a diamond sold at auction was $46 million, for a 24.68-carat pink diamond bought by Laurence Graff in 2010. The auction follows yesterday’s Christie’s sale of the largest fancy-vivid orange diamond known to exist, a 14.82-carat stone that sold for $36 million—the highest price-per-carat ever paid at auction.

If you couple the above with this:

China's wealthy also are pouring money into collectibles and art. Billionaire Wang Jianlin and his company Dalian Wanda last month bought a Picasso at a Christie's auction for $28 million. Bidding from Chinese buyers was strong throughout the auctions, according to dealers and gallerists.

It's also going to wine and diamonds. Diamond dealers say more than half of today's collectible diamonds are going to Chinese buyers. And on Saturday, the world's most expensive case of wine—1978 Romanée-Conti—sold in Hong Kong for $476,000.

from http://www.cnbc.com/id/101225781

One could conclude that while diamonds and colored diamonds may not be a good long term store of value or "investment," they can be a very concentrated store of wealth that can be easily be transported to a safer place. Again, sales of which are not reportable. Someone out there wants these things and is willing to dump a ton of cash on them. They should not be discounted from consideration.

I read that article and drew the same conclusions that the author did. At some point in time, manipulations or not (or specifically... because of them) the megamillionaires who are in the process of "diversifying" will look at underperforming asset classes (metals) and toss a few discretionary spending billion in those directions. This will accelerate the drawdown of above-ground supplies and perhaps hasten the day where physical and paper part ways permanently.

I have to wonder, tho... in these megadeals that are being registered... exchanging those for some other equivalent form of wealth presumes a continuation of our present day state of global affairs. I can't imagine an Andy Warhol, for example, having the same bartering power in a Mad Max scenario as an equivalent amount of PM's

[blackrabbit]

There will be large areas of Mad Max world and walled enclaves of the wealthy. Kind of like today, but more so. The super rich with their fancy art won't be bartering. Only the proles will be doing that.

[Numis Pam]

For me, the answer is silver fractionals, the smaller the better. This means silver as small as one gram, 2.5 and 5 gram pieces, although for the purposes of minimizing expense and amassing more recognizable forms of silver with easily verifiable provenance... 1/10 oz .999, 1/4 oz .999, and 1/2 oz .999 from reputable mints. 90% silver is going to disappear, and I really do think even one ounce silver rounds will eventually prove unwieldy to barter or resale in a revaluation scenario where we're looking at $800 silver and $20,000 gold. Sure, that might be a huge leap of faith for this congregation to
embrace, but certainly it is no worse than the epiphany of
comprehension that fiat is totally worthless, and has value only
under the current regime. Paradigms change... don't become an extinct fiatsaurus.

Where is the best place to buy fractionals right now? What mint has the cheapest prices for good ones? I assume it would be cheapest to purchase larger amounts at a time?

[reddirtcoins]

For me, the answer is silver fractionals, the smaller the better. This means silver as small as one gram, 2.5 and 5 gram pieces, although for the purposes of minimizing expense and amassing more recognizable forms of silver with easily verifiable provenance... 1/10 oz .999, 1/4 oz .999, and 1/2 oz .999 from reputable mints. 90% silver is going to disappear, and I really do think even one ounce silver rounds will eventually prove unwieldy to barter or resale in a revaluation scenario where we're looking at $800 silver and $20,000 gold. Sure, that might be a huge leap of faith for this congregation to
embrace, but certainly it is no worse than the epiphany of
comprehension that fiat is totally worthless, and has value only
under the current regime. Paradigms change... don't become an extinct fiatsaurus.

Where is the best place to buy fractionals right now? What mint has the cheapest prices for good ones? I assume it would be cheapest to purchase larger amounts at a time?

Just buy dimes... bags and bags of them...