You all are a bunch of smart folks

[frugi]

I don't post as often as I used to. I just wanted to say that WE/YOU, all of us, are really smart folks. We have a decade or more ahead of the game, ahead of most folks. Things are starting to be crazy in the world. All of our random ideas, knowledge and "fun" is starting to catch on. A neighbor of mine shared with me yesterday about how I should be saving US nickels because of the metal content. I was proud of her. I was proud of myself, but most of all, in my heart I wept joy for all of us, what we started years ago. We all knew people would catch on, and more will, most people are still dumbarses, so they are still years to go, but it brightened my day to hear from a neighbor about saving nickels, of course I told her about pre82's also. I love you guys.

[Slaphot]

I started hand sorting cents about two years ago. Every once and a while I would read posts on this site and others saying that is was not worth it. Some people on another
site would get emotional about stupid it is. About a month ago I sold all of my copper hoard at a really good price. Now I have a Rydale paid for with copper profit. Now I am sorting more than ever to replace my hoard. History will repeat itself and pre82 will be the new pre64. We are smart!!!

[Joogaler]

I know that's right. I feel smart when I talk to average joes, but when I come here I feel like I know nothing! Many of the realcenters are way ahead of the curve, and I'm glad that they are sharing their wisdom with us. There are very few formats where I can bounce ideas off of people with them understanding me, and trying to help me with my understanding.

[frugi]

I know that's right. I feel smart when I talk to average joes, but when I come here I feel like I know nothing! Many of the realcenters are way ahead of the curve, and I'm glad that they are sharing their wisdom with us. There are very few formats where I can bounce ideas off of people with them understanding me, and trying to help me with my understanding.

You got that right friend. It is a lonely world. None of my friends or acquaintances share my interest. Eventually they will catch on, and it will be comical. I love my family and friends, but seriously they are asleep. I miss those days when I was plugged in to the "matrix". I knew nothing. I feel sorry for most of the USA (like 90%). These folks don't even know the value of a pre82 cent, a US nickel, a Canadian .999 Ni nickel or even what the hell sterling silver looks likem what does .925 mean? seriously when WSHTF 90% of americans are furcked this includes all them and those who owe on the car, the tv, and the couch, and whatever else on the credit card. I am debt free, and hoarding like a MFer, I wish my loved ones had listened to me 10 years ago.

[STINGER]

Unfortunatly as smart as this is it only makes me about 10% less stupid figured in with all the other things i do and have done

[VWBEAMER]

Everyone I tell about pennies and Nickels think i'm stupid, so at least i got you fooled...LOL.

I can't figure out why everyone can't see that buying something for a penny that's worth cents and climbing isn't a bargain....oh well. More for me.

[Pennybug]

Unfortunatly as smart as this is it only makes me about 10% less stupid figured in with all the other things i do and have done

I know that's right. I feel smart when I talk to average joes, but when I come here I feel like I know nothing! Many of the realcenters are way ahead of the curve, and I'm glad that they are sharing their wisdom with us. There are very few formats where I can bounce ideas off of people with them understanding me, and trying to help me with my understanding.

You got that right friend. It is a lonely world. None of my friends or acquaintances share my interest. Eventually they will catch on, and it will be comical. I love my family and friends, but seriously they are asleep. I miss those days when I was plugged in to the "matrix". I knew nothing. I feel sorry for most of the USA (like 90%). These folks don't even know the value of a pre82 cent, a US nickel, a Canadian .999 Ni nickel or even what the hell sterling silver looks likem what does .925 mean? seriously when WSHTF 90% of americans are furcked this includes all them and those who owe on the car, the tv, and the couch, and whatever else on the credit card. I am debt free, and hoarding like a MFer, I wish my loved ones had listened to me 10 years ago.

"I know EXACTLY what you mean....I imagine right now your feeling a bit like Alice, tumbling down the rabbit hole.... Do you know what I'm talking about?"

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3VFDIKgm_QI

Kinda puts that movie in perspective when you look at the world right now.

[NotABigDeal]

Yeah, most still have their heads buried in the sand. I've tried to enlighten a few that I know, but with little success. Some I can get to see the value of the concept, but nobody has started sorting. One guy that used to work with me bought two bags from me. Those were his only searches.

The members of this board are way above par. For sure ahead of the game....

Deal

[Joogaler]

Yeah, most still have their heads buried in the sand. I've tried to enlighten a few that I know, but with little success. Some I can get to see the value of the concept, but nobody has started sorting. One guy that used to work with me bought two bags from me. Those were his only searches.

The members of this board are way above par. For sure ahead of the game....

Deal

I hope you haven't told them about your guns, because when the SHTF they will be lined up at your door!

[STINGER]

I hope you haven't told them about your guns, because when the SHTF they will be lined up at your door!

Lol just mentioned to my brother the other we need to stop shooting so many rounds every week people are gonna know who has the firepower and where it's at

[CrazyTom]

As the saying goes, those who do not study history are doomed to repeat it.

The "C" average is alive and well in this country, fat dumb and happy. That's all about to explode in their bloated faces real soon.......

[plus1hdcp]

I hope you haven't told them about your guns, because when the SHTF they will be lined up at your door!

Lol just mentioned to my brother the other we need to stop shooting so many rounds every week people are gonna know who has the firepower and where it's at

Copper, Silver, Gold and Firepower + Lead - can never have enough

[exbingoaddict]

This forum is full of very sharp people. It’s educational and great to kick around ideas with the chaps here.
Personally, I don’t think that western civilization will collapse in the foreseeable future. If an apocalyptic event came to past, let’s face it, who wants the gold and silver? Of what use is it? At that point, you need water, food, shelter, and the means to protect it. Which I realize that some people have a plan for, Scout’s Motto: Be Prepared. In the fall out shelter, the man with the can opener is King. (Tongue planted in cheek.)

However, that said, I agree that some economic changes are going to come. Maybe slow, maybe fast, you might not even know it until you’re there. Unless U.S. government starts making major cuts in spending, the less good you can feel about the value of the U.S. Dollar. Also, with the amount of spending, we all realize that inflation is going to be lurking down the road. Those two situations are when commodities win. Unless you’re staring out of the back window of a moving car, those two situations are looking less like the future and more like the present.

That said, I give a nod of respect to many of the gents here. Not content to think the government will protect you. Looking ahead and preparing what may come. While none of us hope that the boogie man will come out of the closet, there’s nothing wrong with being ready for it. You’re taking control of your own future.

[NashuaSolstice]

i agree this forum is made of smart people

[wagsthadog]

Hi there-

Just late night rambling, but it strikes me how (non-precious metals) people are catching on to hoarding nickels pretty quickly, is this because it's the easiest and most no-brainer way to invest? But, does that mean that people aren't willing to hoard if it involves work (cents) or a lot of money (gold/silver?) Will this mean the market will be supersaturated with nickels later?

There seems to be some rumblings that nickels are going to be the next big thing, but I don't know. I'd rather get the boxes and look for war nicks. I'd much rather sit on silver/gold than on nickel. I don't like heavy investments!!

wags

I don't post as often as I used to. I just wanted to say that WE/YOU, all of us, are really smart folks. We have a decade or more ahead of the game, ahead of most folks. Things are starting to be crazy in the world. All of our random ideas, knowledge and "fun" is starting to catch on. A neighbor of mine shared with me yesterday about how I should be saving US nickels because of the metal content. I was proud of her. I was proud of myself, but most of all, in my heart I wept joy for all of us, what we started years ago. We all knew people would catch on, and more will, most people are still dumbarses, so they are still years to go, but it brightened my day to hear from a neighbor about saving nickels, of course I told her about pre82's also. I love you guys.

[scrapper2010]

I am also of the opinion that an all out SHTF scenario is unlikely in the near future. I just know too many smart, hard working American's in my town and many others to think that is going to happen. Sure a healthy distrust of government is a good thing, but I think this country will come out strong by sticking to that one rule of keeping the government in check through the democratic process. America has seen much worse days and harder times. And I agree with the original post. There are some people on this forum who blow me away with their knowledge of precious metals, numismatics, and econmonics in general. Not to mention sense of humor and sense of brotherhood.

[68Camaro]

"Hope for the best, prepare for the worst" - that attitude will keep anyone both mentally healthy as well as physically safe.

I appreciate your attitude. I would like to say that I have faith in humanity, but the fact is, I don't. Humans, in general, are fundamentally corrupt beings. Next to that, I would like to say I have faith in Americans... I used to. But while I haven't completely lost all faith there, especially in those raised well from within the heartland, I'm now too jaded by what I've seen the past 30 years of decline to be fully trustful of our ability as a country to continue to withstand the corruption that is eating us up from within. As just one item in this... What millions of Americans have done just in the last four years, effectively stealing billions (from the rest of us, and from our children and grandchildren!) by re-financing houses at 2x to 3x the real value (which should never have been allowed to happen), blowing the money, then running from their debts afterwards, is simply a crime. You can blame the government. You can blame the banks. But the fundamental cause of most of it is the moral corruption of mainstream America. Most people of my parents generation would have attempted to honor their debt, instead of running from it. (Actually, they never would have put themselves in that place in the first case, but that's another matter.) It isn't being prosecuted because when it's done on such a broad scale; it's simply too large a problem to prosecute. So the society has create excuses to accept it. I'm appalled by it.

I'll also respectfully disagree that we've seen worse days and harder times. They were just different, and there is still more to come. If you really believe the government stats I agree one would say that times were worse back when. But the real unemployment rate is >20%, not 9%, and the only reason you're not seeing depression era foodlines and panic is due to short-term government handouts borrowed from China. Those cannot continue.

I agree that there are some mitigating factors that will try to keep it from getting fully out of control. We can hope and pray for those. I started to expand on this, but don't want to become known as Mr Gloom and Doom. I'm really more cheerful than that, usually.

[scrapper2010]

68Camero, I also agree with most of what you said. One thing I always wonder is what will happen to the economy if Chinese labor isn't always cheap. Manufacturing jobs come back to the States?

[Joogaler]

I used to be a strong believer in the capitalist system, but not so much right now. It's a good system when people use good morals and common sense. But what we've seen is corporations buying up the smaller corporations, and destroying competition. They don't compete with the other large corporations, they seem to work together.

It would be like if I got together will all of the copper penny sellers, and decide that we should all raise our price to 3.5X FV. Of course a few guys would try to compete, but do you think they would still sell at 1.7 X FV shipped? I highly doubt it, but you never know until it happens.

That's what we've seen with the corporations. So the government decides that big business is making too much money, so they raise the taxes on big business. What does big business do? They raise their prices, cut workers, and send jobs overseas to make up for the tax increase! Do you really think they are going to make less money, just cause of some tax???

This is where to capitalist system is failing. Everything works just fine when you have honest companies, and a honest government. But all we're seeing is backroom deals between the corporations, and our government.

But things are changing. Hopefully we will see things go back to a constitutional government, not a government of sell out globalist's like we've seen for that past 10+ years.

[exbingoaddict]

I used to be a strong believer in the capitalist system, but not so much right now. It's a good system when people use good morals and common sense. But what we've seen is corporations buying up the smaller corporations, and destroying competition. They don't compete with the other large corporations, they seem to work together.

It would be like if I got together will all of the copper penny sellers, and decide that we should all raise our price to 3.5X FV. Of course a few guys would try to compete, but do you think they would still sell at 1.7 X FV shipped? I highly doubt it, but you never know until it happens.

That's what we've seen with the corporations. So the government decides that big business is making too much money, so they raise the taxes on big business. What does big business do? They raise their prices, cut workers, and send jobs overseas to make up for the tax increase! Do you really think they are going to make less money, just cause of some tax???

This is where to capitalist system is failing. Everything works just fine when you have honest companies, and a honest government. But all we're seeing is backroom deals between the corporations, and our government.

But things are changing. Hopefully we will see things go back to a constitutional government, not a government of sell out globalist's like we've seen for that past 10+ years.

Joogaler, we can agree on some points. There is a lot collusion between big business and big governement. No doubt about that. Capitalism, while not perfect, is still a better way of life then a governement run command economy. (What is the GDP of North Korea again?) The great lesson of the 20th century was that massive central planning fails. Though many people have failed to learn that lesson.

Keep in mind, you, yourself, are engaging in the free market place. You can become very successful and wealthy in spite of the governement and large business. That is the upside of capitalism.

[Joogaler]

I used to be a strong believer in the capitalist system, but not so much right now. It's a good system when people use good morals and common sense. But what we've seen is corporations buying up the smaller corporations, and destroying competition. They don't compete with the other large corporations, they seem to work together.

It would be like if I got together will all of the copper penny sellers, and decide that we should all raise our price to 3.5X FV. Of course a few guys would try to compete, but do you think they would still sell at 1.7 X FV shipped? I highly doubt it, but you never know until it happens.

That's what we've seen with the corporations. So the government decides that big business is making too much money, so they raise the taxes on big business. What does big business do? They raise their prices, cut workers, and send jobs overseas to make up for the tax increase! Do you really think they are going to make less money, just cause of some tax???

This is where to capitalist system is failing. Everything works just fine when you have honest companies, and a honest government. But all we're seeing is backroom deals between the corporations, and our government.

But things are changing. Hopefully we will see things go back to a constitutional government, not a government of sell out globalist's like we've seen for that past 10+ years.

Joogaler, we can agree on some points. There is a lot collusion between big business and big governement. No doubt about that. Capitalism, while not perfect, is still a better way of life then a governement run command economy. (What is the GDP of North Korea again?) The great lesson of the 20th century was that massive central planning fails. Though many people have failed to learn that lesson.

Keep in mind, you, yourself, are engaging in the free market place. You can become very successful and wealthy in spite of the governement and large business. That is the upside of capitalism.

Thanks for agreeing with me. That's why I said it takes good morals, and common sense for capitalism to work. It used to be about helping the community, and making a living. But mostly what we see now is dollar signs in their eyes. Just watch t.v. for five minutes, and you'll law firm commercials about unsafe drugs etc. Half of these companies know that their drug isn't 99.99% safe for their target, but they know that they have to money to pay the lawsuits, and still make out like a bandit!

I love the fact that in this country we have an opportunity to start our own business, and with hard work and determination make something of ourselves. But when you leave out the well being of others just to make a buck then that's wrong.

Also how can we have a sustainable economy, when wealth is slowly sucked from the taxpayer, to the government, thus in turn to be given to the fed to pay off their loan? Eventually in theory the money would all be back in the banks possession correct? If everyone's debt were paid off, there would be no money!

[commoncents]

What we have in this country is not capitalism and has not been anything close to capitalism for many decades. We have 'the mixed economy' - a mixture of private investment and government interference. The interference is partly (1) government removal or bailout of risk for the politically well connected, (2) government tax policy aimed at maximum revenue, (3) politically motivated regulation that usually does not accomplish it's STATED objective, (4) government subtile suppression of less politically connected businesses, (5) scape goating regulations and taxes for the sake of political grandstanding (6) and some interferences that are less clear as to their intent or effect.

The enemies of capitalism point to real problems and invariably blame the problem on the capitalistic aspects of the mixed economy. In fact, the cause of the problem is almost always caused by the semi-socialistic aspects. It's important to identify things correctly.

[68Camaro]

I started to disagree with your label, having previously called it something else, but dug a little more and found that either definitions have changed from my memory, or I had it wrong. Current thinking seems to be calling it by your name, aka Economic Progressivism (as it applies to the economy). We have definitely been co-opted by the progressives since the time of Wilson.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Economic_progressivism

[Joogaler]

I started to disagree with your label, having previously called it something else, but dug a little more and found that either definitions have changed from my memory, or I had it wrong. Current thinking seems to be calling it by your name, aka Economic Progressivism (as it applies to the economy). We have definitely been co-opted by the progressives since the time of Wilson.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Economic_progressivism

I completely agree with you, they want to "spread the wealth around", but socialism doesn't work that way. Almost everyone ends up being poor under that system more like spread the debt around.

I've been thinking and studying the economy, and monetary policy, and I got a few questions.

How can everyone live well? It is physically impossible for everyone to be rich. iIn the system their are the rich, the middle class, and the poor. If say you gave everyone in this country that makes 10k or less a year lets say $100,000 what would happen? The market would raise their prices because they know people will still pay right? I'm kinda babbling, but I don't know how to put it.

Also how can we have a sustainable economy free from recessions/depressions? Isn't the wealth absorbed by the fed for the borrowed money?

[68Camaro]

There's at least one university economist that's a member (believe it's the guy that recently built his own fairly cool Sniper coin feeder?). Don't know his philosophy, but maybe he can get into the weeds of this with you, no matter what viewpoint he holds...

My quick 2 cents.

1) "Well" is relative.
2) Everyone could be at the same level, but that's called communism, and it wouldn't be at a level we would all like to be at.
3) I would like to be rewarded for my efforts. That means that people that work harder, smarter, or both, are rewarded better. That's the root of capitalism. Over time that eventually leads to different levels of financial ability. In capitalism, people that are lazy or stupid (if I can be blunt) or both, don't do so well. And they eventually complain. And liberals feel sorry for them for some reason, and want to redistribute my wealth (such as it is) to the lazy and stupid.
4) Please note that I'm not talking about truly unfortunates; we should all - voluntarily - desire and act to help people that are truly in trouble and need.
5) Money is not happiness. You can be happy with less money; for that, you need to "need" less. We should all strive to need less, in whatever sense works for us, individually. It's easily to be happier that way.
6) Cyclic economies are inevitable. But it's a matter of degree. The financial institutions in place are all various remedies that have been attempted in order to keep the amplitude of the cycles to a minimum and the frequency to maximum. They don't always work well, as we have recently seen.
7) Ahh, the fed. Now that's a good topic for a research study...