"hoarders will be able to acquire only an estimated $34"

[68Camaro]

I'm not going to try to persuade anyone else, but here are my reasons for having some. Note - "some". Not a heavy investment, but some.

a) I save any I get in change.
b) Further, I've bought a few bricks

Rationale (assuming you have an otherwise balanced portfolio and the FRNs to spare):

a) easy to convert back to FRNs, especially the unopened bricks
b) no risk, no discount or cost to sell, no possiblity of loss
c) no labor
d) widely recognized without people having to check metal content or year
e) the Cu-Ni alloy is itself a useful corrosion resistant material in its own right
f) even if silver becomes a currency again, less valuable coins will still be needed, and these are the most likely candidate.

[ZenOps]

Nickel has been as high as $23/pound. Its always been a denser store of value than copper. Much like how gold is a much denser store of value than silver.

So a $2 roll of Pure Canadian pre-81's was worth a little over $9 back in 2007. Currently a 50-cent roll of pennies is worth not quite $1.50

If you have infinite space (many square feet) and aren't living in an apartment (where you might have a weight restriction, beyond which you can't store more than a couple tons without risking hurting the people below you) then copper is a *slightly* better value at this particular point in time.

Nickel has also been in shortage with delivery defaults in varying years, 1942 to 45, 1969 and 2007. Silver and copper have yet to be in "default".

IMO - Nickel will see $80/pound before copper sees $10/pound. Also: Canada could at any time stop selling nickel to the US, much like how China stopped selling Neodymium to the US means Quadruple price in six months. The US produces no Neodymium or Nickel in significant quantity, and although there are a lot of 5-cent 1.25 gram nickels in the US - it would take nearly a million of them to make a ton.

[adagirl]

For me it is all about diversification. I hoard way more pennies than nickels, but I want a brick a week of nickels in addition to pennies I sort and PM I stash away. Also the amount of production of nickels vs the penny adds to the collectiability and potential upside should the nice government men change the metal composition of the nickel.

[frugi]

Might not be long before people start hoarding zinc

zinc has a super strong outlook for the future as an investment metal!

How about those 2011's nonmagnetics, I here those are hot in Canada right now?

[frugi]

I've thought the same, so I keep Cu as well as particularly nice dirt/grime/stain-free zincs. Not many.. maybe an average of $2 out of every $100. Just enough to have a small start

zinc numismatics are a great investment right now, you can't lose! I do exactly the same thing! That thin copper plating gets easily corroded by the zinc simply getting through to air, which severely corrodes zinc! I especially like the year of 1982 for numismatic saving, very few US coins have more than 6 varities for any particular year, 1982 has 7 varities of one coin, that is really cool, and 100 years from now many of those varities will look like whitsh/grey powder nothing, likely not even worth a cent.

[adagirl]

Might not be long before people start hoarding zinc

zinc has a super strong outlook for the future as an investment metal!

How about those 2011's nonmagnetics, I here those are hot in Canada right now?

Right-o I agree.

[frugi]

I know I'm sounding like a broken record at this point but I still don't understand the math nickel hoarders are using...I guess I'm just crazy

Looking at coinflation: http://www.coinflation.com/coins/baseme ... lator.html

$10.00 face of 95% copper pennies = Total melt value is $25.93.

$10.00 face of nickels = Total melt value is $11.87.

So do you want to tie your money up for $1.87 or $15.93?

The value of the nickel is in its copper content not the nickel value....UGH!!!!!!

Sure you might find a war nickel or buffalo... but you will find probably twice as many more wheat pennies.

To each his own, but I still don't understand way.....

Cu-

[adagirl]

Cu-Ni is considered contaminated Nickel at the scrapyard.....it is worth way less than you will actually get, I always bring this up every once in awhile, it is a bummer, and may still have barter value.......but I know, I scrapped over 2000 pounds of Canadian .999 Ni five cent coins back a few years back, I drove for over a month to 7 different states, and took in profit of over $10,000.00 in one month

So would the scrapyeards consider 95% Cu pennies contaminated?

[frugi]

it is worth way less than you will actually get

Oops! I meant to say "You will actually get way less than you think".


It would be valued as contaminated Cu, or contaminated Ni, whichever way produces a substantially inferior lump of metal when compared to pure .999 Ni, and pure .999 Ni.

It without a doubt costs less money to make a widget using raw, pure .999 Ni, and combining it with raw, pure .999 Cu, than it would cost to seperate the two metals and starting the above process. If you don't believe me on this one, keep hoarding,,,,,while I don't hoard any USA nickels, I still won't spend them, but I don't EVER buy USA nickels more than a single roll, I believe it is a bad investment. I vote 100% Canadian and hoard those like I am a (crazy hoarder on A&E). But I know I am right.

Another way to look at it is karats of gold below 9kt (.375% pure). there is plenty of it out there but nobody wants it because it is so expensive in relation to your profit, that is of course unless it is given to you for free, which can be thought of in jewelry terms but not ever coins, because even a coin costs you money if you find it on the sidewalk, and then destroy it, you still just invested your new found wealth, but jewelry, potentially could be had for free, but here in America most jewelers care little for, and are unaware of any karats of gold below 10kt (.417% pure), and not many know of 8kt (.333% pure). The point is, yes it is gold, yes it is Ni, yes it is Cu, but in the end nobody wants to be nice, everyone wants to make $, and your local scrapper is definitely paying really low on Cupro-nickel, call and ask, trust me it would be sad.

[frugi]

So would the scrapyeards consider 95% Cu pennies contaminated?

no. but it would not be number 1 copper, more like rated as bronze @ the scrapyard.

but Canadian cents are mostly above .950, i believe. at least until 1996, i think. I think many are .980 pure which IS number 1 copper........(but I defintely hoard US bronze like a mofo), even as bronze they are still scrappable at approximatelly what coinflation says, and all the other Canadian coins as well, just not any that are Cupro-nickel, and possibly not Tombac, or brass, steel, zinc, or anything else weird they used in the past other than silver or gold. Anything really weird, you can "still calculate" a "make-believe metal value" based on the metal content, but in the end the real science says, not a winner. Too hard to extract, but again make it easy and call your local scrapyards, and find out about cupro-nickel scrap prices.

[adagirl]

I hear ya, there for a while I was going after Canadian Ni, and I have a reasonable stash, but nothing like Nickelmeister. Wow, I really need to educate myself on this stuff. I don't know what defines #1 Cu, #2 Cu, contaiminated, etc.

[frugi]

contaminated mostly refers to the dangers involved when you smelt it, the more hazardous and potentially lethal a mouthful would be the less the metal is worth, especially if it is mixed in with other metals. Obviously, nobody is taking any mouthfuls of poisonous 1000 degree burning gases and smoke, but nevertheless, it is relatively easy to melt lead on your own or to melt zinc or tin, all very dangerous, but relatively easy to do and avoid smoke and gas, and wear protective clothing and/or respirators. Obviously gold and silver are super easy. Copper is harder to melt down then the previous few, but still possible on your own, but nickel, and every alloy associated with it you need some heavy duty equipment, and a large facility, otherwise you are just heating up metal. Bronze isn't hard to melt but brass is really hard to melt so, yes you have abunch to learn, and don't go with everything I said, I learn from experience and from making tons of errors, some errors I have to keep making over and over again until I learn.

[adagirl]

One step at a time, baby steps I guess. I will stick with my aluminum scrapping and other easily available metals and move into other areas in time.

[frugi]

there is no time. hoard everything, just don't worry about smelting or melting anything...no reason too.

[adagirl]

Yes sir, I am with you! I am hoarding everything, and I will learn the difference between the metals and how to distingiush/recognize metals as I go, but for now it is full steam ahead at hoarding everything!!

[mtalbot_ca]

Just got lucky,

As you know, the .999 nickel supply in Canada is going down (ARP). I was able to purchase, from the son of a deceased nickel hoarder, over 30lbs of pure nickels for 250$, and at that price, he threw in 1,00 face value of 80% silver quarters.

Cheers,

[adagirl]

Just got lucky,

As you know, the .999 nickel supply in Canada is going down (ARP). I was able to purchase, from the son of a deceased nickel hoarder, over 30lbs of pure nickels for 250$, and at that price, he threw in 1,00 face value of 80% silver quarters.

Cheers,

You might want to check with Nickelmeister here on RC if you are looking for more Canadian nickel. He does a nice job with prompt shipping.

[OtusLotus]

Mossy.. at $34, the number of nickels is 680 per person.

[camtender]

With Kyle Bass storing $1,000,000 in US nickles, he just took a whole bunch of peoples' $34 hoard (as in 29,412 people), WOW!

[adagirl]

With Kyle Bass storing $1,000,000 in US nickles, he just took a whole bunch of peoples' $34 hoard (as in 29,412 people), WOW!

He certainely did not get my $34 worth And for that matter, he didn't get the folks on RC $34 worth either. While I doubt anyone on here as 1M worth in nickels, we likely have many multiples of the $34

Keep on hoarding. It seems time is running short. The occupy wall street gig seems like it might be the US version of riots, etc that were happening in the UK, Europe and Middle East. It doesn't take much for a protest to turn into a riot, looting, etc.

[Recyclersteve]

"Underlying the anxiety is a stark statistic: if just 10 percent of the American population catches on, hoarders will be able to acquire only an estimated $34 (face value) worth of nickels before every last one has been removed from circulation."

Can this statement from the Newsweek article be substantiated?

Just a thought about the 10% figure used above- as nice as it would be to have a stash of basic and precious metals for the SHTF scenario, think about basic food and water. If I went door-to-door in California taking a poll (because everyone there "should be" prepared for food shortages in the event of a serious earthquake), do you think even 10% of the people in California would have a month's supply of drinking water? (Assume that I could have access to all the houses to verify their claims, which I know is total fantasy.)

If not, how can we expect anywhere near 10% of the population to hoard nickels? I would guesstimate that if even 1% of the population hoarded nickels, they'd be practically as hard to get as silver half dollars- unless the govt. changed the composition to steel or zinc. And when people learned that nickel is on the list of known carcinogens at the http://www.cancer.org website, some people would say "I don't want those things anywhere near me!"